I am finally sick of IE 6 sp1. I agree with Jeysie that it is time for me to switch. My browser was switched to msn.com by the Windows Upgrade Advisor and this is what made me decide to finally switch browsers. I am really interested in a full reply by Jeysie since she seems to have a great deal of expertise in this area. I am leaning towards downloading and running FireFox. What is everyones opinion of FireFox, Mozilla, Opera, etc. I appreciate everyones opinion because it will help me to determine which browser I should use in the future. I am very content with 98SE as my operating system and plan to dual boot when XP Pro. SP2 is released. Thank you for your time and have a great night. ;-D
This is my advise.
Get Internet 5.0
Get Windows 98se
Get DirectX 9.0b
Get MSN 6.2
This is why i like too stay with the low stuff, the high stuff gives too much problems. Especially Windows XP and I.E6.0
My "capsule" opinions:
Firefox: Strikes me as sort of a "download and go" browser, for those who are sort of "casual" web surfers. The browser itself doesn't have a lot of features built-in, but you can download extensions. Downside is that there's no guarantee that extensions will work well with each other since AFAIK none of them are really "official". Also, AFAIK there's no automatic installer yet, it's a "unzip the zip file" sort of thing. Upside is that if you're a programmer, you can help tweak the browser code, or make your own extensions. And if you don't care much about tweaking, it's a fast, easy browser to get going with.
Opera: More of a "power web surfer" browser. Browser itself is packed full of features and customizing options. (And is smaller than FireFox and Mozilla, go figure.) Downside is that it takes a bit of time investment up front to tinker with and learn the features and get things set up the way you like. Also, the free version has an ad banner. Upside is that it's a very powerful browser if you do enough web surfing that tweaking a browser to suit your style is important. Great for web developing, too.
Mozilla: Somewhere in between FireFox and Opera, both in features and web surfer type consideration. Larger download than both. I think Mozilla might actually be started to phase out in favor of FireFox, but I'm not entirely sure.
All three browsers are about on the same level of HTML, CSS, Javascript, etc. support and rendering quality. Mozilla/Firefox is a bit better at Javascript and handling sites coded to be IE-only, Opera has slightly better pure standards-compliant HTML and CSS support, all IMHO.
I'm afraid I'm not very familiar with the other non-IE Windows browsers out there (well, except Lynx ;) ), but AFAIK most of them are based on the same Gecko engine as Mozilla anyway.
Peace & Luv, Liz
Quote from: daventry on May 15, 2004, 02:19:19 AM
Get MSN 6.2
get plus!! :lovegoggles: ...I love the automessages :lovegoggles: ; )
If you must use an instant messenging service -- Why not Trillian? Also, I plan to try Firefox but I have not gotten around to trying it yet. It intrigues me the most out of all the other browsers that are offered and it is free and free is good as long as you do not get unwelcome guests along with the free goodie. (meaning spyware, adware, viruses, malware, keyloggers, etc.) ;)
According to Jeysie, Trillian no longer connects to the MSN network. :-\
Actually, AFAIK it does... provided you have Internet Explorer 5+ installed, which I don't. ;P Most Windows-running people won't have that issue.
Peace & Luv, Liz
I think the Mozilla line is the opposite. It stops pop-ups,viruses,etc. Compared to normal Internet Explorer anyways(I haven't tried the newest version of it, so I might be wrong).
Quote from: Jeysie on May 15, 2004, 08:39:13 AMAlso, AFAIK there's no automatic installer yet, it's a "unzip the zip file" sort of thing.
Automatic installer is available on the newest version.
In Firefox I have yet to find the option to warn me when I send something over an unencrypted transfer method, such as on this forum. I think I saw it once (not on this forum though) but never again afterwards. :-\
Quote from: Jeysie on May 20, 2004, 02:46:01 PMActually, AFAIK it does... provided you have Internet Explorer 5+ installed, which I don't. ;P Most Windows-running people won't have that issue.
Due to my grudge against M$, I refuse to use anything that's using stuff from IE. >:( So I'm using GAIM on my XP Home machine too. :-X )
Quote from: Louisiana Night on May 20, 2004, 02:53:22 PMI think the Mozilla line is the opposite. It stops pop-ups,viruses,etc. Compared to normal Internet Explorer anyways(I haven't tryed the newest version of it, so I might be wrong).
I'm pretty sure IE stops pop-ups too, if you want. Stopping viruses is more a task for AV-programs, not browsers.
IE doesn't natively block pop-ups. The only way to block pop-ups in IE is:
1. Download one of those IE shells like MyIE2.
2. Download a separate pop-up/ad blocker program.
3. Do some mucking about with setting up the Internet Security Zones to disable javascript on some sites.
IMHO, if you're going to the route of 1 or 2 you're better off just downloading Mozilla or Opera anyway... then you can block pop-ups/ads *and* get a better all-around browser experience. And 3 is just a pain in the butt. (Not to mention that you'll likely end up disabling a lot of basic functionality other than pop-ups that way, thanks to non-saavy webmasters.)
Peace & Luv, Liz
Thanks for your input, Jeysie. What do you think about XP Service Pack II that will have IE updates at least for XP users. As I am a 98SE user, I will probably go the FireFox route. However, I have heard that it is still in beta. Any idea when version 1.0 will come out? :>
Quote from: dew7 on May 24, 2004, 09:55:58 AMAs I am a 98SE user, I will probably go the FireFox route. However, I have heard that it is still in beta. Any idea when version 1.0 will come out? :>
Well, I suppose technically it's in beta, but it's still a stable enough browser to use now. (Besides, AFAIK it doesn't install to system files or the registry or anything, so it's not like it can corrupt your system.) As for when they'll hit 1.0, your best bet is to keep tabs on their website, or ask the question there. :)
Peace & Luv, Liz
Thanks, Liz. I appreciate the information. Do you know if FireFox contains any spyware, malware, viruses, or anything else. Also, could you post the official website. I do not want to be phised. Thanks again! :>
Nope, FireFox just has pure, wholesome, yummy browser goodness. ;)
Official site is: http://www.mozilla.org/
Peace & Luv, Liz
Quote from: Jeysie on May 23, 2004, 03:18:12 PMIE doesn't natively block pop-ups.
*wakes up his work laptop nearby, looks at the IE-options and fails to locate anything relating to pop-ups*
Hmmm, you seem to be right. But I don't have the most recent browser available :o
(dang, that's the second time he refuses to shut down/go to sleep again!)
Anyway, I think I'm going to try the 'pure' Mozilla shortly. My download manager doesn't register FireFox as Mozilla-type. :-\
Okay, I found out what the confusion is about. Firefox went under different names(trademark problems?), in older versions. In order of version(oldest, to latest)Phoenix, Firebird, Firefox.
http://www.avantbrowser.com/
Thats what i use lets me open multiple websites in one window, and has a popup blocker that actually works.
I'll try it, although I doubt I'll want to make it my main browser.
P.S. Do you need Internet Explorer to use it?
Yeah, Avant's an IE-shell, IIRC. It needs IE to run. Bah, I say. :D
Peace & Luv, Liz
So...
It's like(or is) one of those freeware upgrades to IE?
Yep. You're better off downloading and using a whole different browser, IMHO.
Peace & Luv, Liz
Just do Firefox, it can automatically grab all your favorites/cookies/Etc from I.E anyway if you want it to.
It's 4.2 megabytes...reltively painless
What does everyone think of mouse gestures?
I think they can be useful, but I prefer key combinations(shortcut keys).
I'm too much of a spaz for mouse gestures to be useful, but most of the Opera users I know swear by them.
I'm sort of a "two-handed" surfer... right-handed mouse clickies for stuff on the top and right... scrollbar and toolbar buttons. Left hand keyboard for everything else... Z and X for back/forward, 1 and 2 for going from pagebar tab to pagebar tab, CTRL-SHIFT for Open in Background Page, etc.
Peace & Luv, Liz
Are mouse gestures like the gestures in Black and white where you make cool patterns as shortcuts to spells? Or am i on totally the wrong track?
Quote from: Drunken Chinchilla on July 13, 2004, 03:15:32 PMAre mouse gestures like the gestures in Black and white where you make cool patterns as shortcuts to spells? Or am i on totally the wrong track?
Hmm. I never played Black And White, but... an excerpt from the Opera help file:
QuoteGo to previous page
Method 1: hold right button, click left button
Method 2: hold right button, move mouse left
Go to next page
Method 1: hold left button, click right button
Method 2: hold right button, move mouse right
Go to parent directory
Hold right button, move up then left
Go to home page
Double-click in empty page
Reload page
Hold right button, move up then down
Stop loading
Hold right button, move up
Open link in new page
Move mouse pointer to link and hold right button, move down
Open link in new background page
Move mouse pointer to link and hold right button, move down then up
Hope that gives an idea.
Peace & Luv, Liz
Thats like the best thing ever for the lazy person in me!
Look! No hands! (well kinda, in a way...)
I usually use shortcut keys when browsing the internet :P
BTW i think Mozilla is better than Firefox because from what i read Firefox doesnt have a popup blocker :-\
Firefox has a popup blocker.
Mozilla is finished. (V 1.7)
Firefox isn't finished. (V .9.2)
Another reason that I like Firefox(and the Mozilla line).
Gnusto.
It's an extension that let's you play Z-code adventure games, in your browser.
Get it here (http://texturizer.net/firefox/extensions/).
I am now using my dual-boot system of 98SE and XP Pro. and they both have Firefox installed. I will try it out for a while and see if it is better than IE. At least FireFox is open-source and people can fix the errors quickly. My dad is going to try FireFox also. :>
Well FireFox crashed on me and I had to use IE to connect. I guess this is why it is still a beta. :>
Hee, and IE never crashes on you? You must have a magic computer. ;)
Almost every program crashes at some point, beta or not.
Peace & Luv, Liz
QuoteWell FireFox crashed on me and I had to use IE to connect. I guess this is why it is still a beta. :>
Try Mozilla, it's not a beta.
I am still using FireFox. I do not mind a crash now and then and yes IE will crash sometimes too. :>
Firefox has received a Softy award from Maximum PC( they gave it one last year also )! :D
Firefox continues to gain market share. :)
I still prefer Mozilla over Firfox, Firefox is similar to IE and thats basically what I hate about it :-\
Firefox has no ActiveX vulnerabilities and that's what I like about it. <eg>
Another reason I don't use Firefox is because I need to download all the plugins XD
I don't know what that needing to download plugins is about( plugins=optional )...
but I do agree that Mozilla is just as good as Firefox. :)
As far as I'm concerned, the main non-IE browsers(Opera, Mozilla, Firefox) are a matter of preference, and that none of them are better than the others ( each might be better at certain things, but overall, I'd say they're quite equal ) . :P
You technically don't need to download plugins to browse with Firefox it's true, but the bare browser itself is a bit lacking in features (though still better than IE, IMHO). In order to reap the feature benefits of Firefox you need to install extensions.
Which is why I personally prefer Opera... lots of features already built-in and still a tiny package. :D
Mozilla's nice as well since it also comes "feature-ready", it just runs slower on my old-geezer machine than Opera (and isn't customizable enough for my personal tastes).
Peace & Luv, Liz
Oddly, the main reason I use Firefox(instead of a different browser), is that I prefer the extension system. XD
I like choosing what features I use in my browser(that, and it gives Firefox the ability to do things, that the others can't/don't).
My main problem with Opera, is you either have to buy it(I'm not paying for an internet browser ;P ), or you have to deal with adds. :-\
Ordinarily I'm also the type who likes to be able to install just what they need. But in most cases installing just what you need results in a smaller/faster program. Considering that Opera is already smaller/faster than basic Firefox on my system, I'll live with just ignoring what I don't use. :D Plus I've found that after finding the time to give some features I initially ignored a try, I find them quite useful after all (like mouse gestures).
If I'd tried Firefox first, I'd probably have liked it. It's a good browser. But I'm so used now to using a ton of Opera's features (especially for webmastering) that I'd have to keep track of a ton of extensions to do the equivalent in Firefox. I'm too lazy. ;P
As for ads, I use the free version with Google text ads at work, and it's in a little thin strip at the top of the screen. Not a big deal for such a nice browser. (Plus it's kind of funny seeing what shows up for each site I visit...)
I registered the one I use at home, since $39 for a program I literally use for at least 5 hours a day nearly every day is a fair deal, IMHO. Heck, don't we sometimes pay $50+ for games we play for about 20 hours a couple times?
Anyway, when it comes to which types of features a person likes in a browser, it's up to personal preference, I'm not going to dispute that. I just think that the money/ad thing in specific is a silly thing to get caught up on.
Peace & Luv, Liz
At least Opera offers a student discount. :D
I convinced my dad to use Firefox and now he likes it better than IE. He uses plugins and extensions. I just use the basic browser with one plugin and I have found no need for having other plugins. I like to keep things simple in this case and I do not want the chance of downloading something bad via an extension or plugin for Firefox. :P
Personally, although there are features in Opera I wish were in Firefox, I prefer Firefox. :P
and as for spending money on Opera, it's simple...
me=cheap ;P
Also, I tend to support open-source software ( gives the users more of a say, in how it works ) . :)
btw, I DO have Opera installed on my PC... I just rarely use it. :-\
I like the philosophy behind open-source, definitely!
But sometimes you just gotta go with what works best. Besides, since I can't program, if I desire changes in a program I need to request other people to make them whether I use open or closed-source software anyway. And not only is a company you paid money to more obligated to listen to your requests, but I feel like less of a leech. :P
If you have programming skill, than I think you're definitely going to benefit from using open-source software whenever you can. But if you're just an Average Joe/Jane like moi it's not as strong a draw on its own (unless the closed-source alternative is way too expensive, like Photoshop vs. GIMP or something).
Peace & Luv, Liz
This summer, Microsoft plans to release the IE7 beta. It will require SP2.
That is all. :P
Cool! I was wondering when MS would react to Firefox. :P
*dusts off thread*
(old)news in the browsers wars:
Opera is now free(the add banner is gone)
And I don't believe MS ever released an IE7 beta. ;P
Um, I like Firefox. :P
Agrees that Mozilla Firefox is really good ;)
New security warnings on IE:
http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/technology/4849904.stm
http://www.eeye.com/html/research/alerts/AL20060324.html
http://www.microsoft.com/technet/security/advisory/917077.mspx
Yet another reason to stick to Firefox or another alternative browser
Speaking of which... IE7(beta) is a lot better than IE6(though I still prefer Opera). :P
I have not yet tried Opera. LN, do you like it better than Firefox? I also have not tried testing the IE 7 beta but maybe I will try to test it for fun.
Yes, I prefer Opera over Firefox.
It took me a while to become accustomed to the interface(I customized it like mad, especially the keyboard commands/shortcuts), but most information points to it being more secure, it lacks many characteristics that bother me about Firefox(such as the tabs, no matter how many you make, do not go off the screen), and it's now free(it lacks the ads). Even if it still used ads and cost $s, I'd still prefer it.
Granted, Firefox has many advantages over Opera(including increased site compatibility), but Opera is still my browser of choice.
LN, you might also like the fact that Opera still supports Windows 95 according to this post from the 98 general newsgroup.
"Note that this is for Firefox 3, to be released sometime in 2007. Firefox 2 will
still support Windows 9x.
Note also that Opera 9 will support Win9x, including Windows 95!
Meanwhile, Internet Explorer 7 will support Windows XP SP2 and higher... Go
figure."
Ivan
I <3 Opera...
And it's very rare now that a site won't work right in it. ;) Usually changing it to IE mode does the trick.
Well, I decided to download and install Opera. I find it okay so far but I think it is really nice that the Opera folks are willing to support even Windows 95 and NT for the folks with really old computers. LOL 8)
Look for the leighblue skin. ;) It is extrememly minimal and makes everything look much cleaner.
What number and in what category is that skin or did you expect me to search them all --- ::) :P ;)
I use Firefox religiously, lol. Never tried Opera before!
Quote from: dew7 on May 02, 2006, 10:35:11 PM
What number and in what category is that skin or did you expect me to search them all --- ::) :P ;)
http://my.opera.com/community/customize/skins/?search=leighblue
Tada!
Thanks for the link, Oldbushie. Unfortunately, I had to unistall Opera. It was causing Mozilla Firefox and my sound card to crash for some reason.
I tend to split my time between Firefox and IE. Firefox due to its tabs and IE due to the quick openes ;P
Quote from: MangoMercury on May 02, 2006, 10:39:01 PM
I use Firefox religiously, lol. Never tried Opera before!
I've tried Opera, but I still use Firefox religiously. :)
I <3 Firefox!
I <3 Firefox too. ^^ I'm stuck using IE because I can't install anything on the two computers that work though. ;P
Why not, Rosella?
They use XP and I'm not an administrator.
Mobile Firefox (http://mobilefirefox.com/)
Admin account not required. ;)
I didn't get my copy from that site, but I assume they are the same thing.
Quote from: Rosella on May 04, 2006, 01:52:36 PM
I <3 Firefox too. ^^ I'm stuck using IE because I can't install anything on the two computers that work though. ;P
I thought Rosella meant she had only two computers that worked (as in ran) and so I was puzzled why a working computer could not have something installed. However, I see that she meant at her work. (aka job -- grin)
Psst... Rosella doesn't have a job. :P
Quote from: Yonkey on May 05, 2006, 06:59:28 AM
Psst... Rosella doesn't have a job. :P
Sure she does! She's Forum Princess! ;-D
And to make this post at least somewhat On-Topic, I only use Firefox. <3
Actually, my laptop doesn't feel like connecting to the internet anymore, and my desktop is just dead. XD
Thanks for the correction, Yonkey and Rosella. BTW, are there any particular extensions that people especially like in Firefox.
Quote from: dew7 on May 03, 2006, 01:29:31 PM
Thanks for the link, Oldbushie. Unfortunately, I had to unistall Opera. It was causing Mozilla Firefox and my sound card to crash for some reason.
How? o_O
Did you have both browsers running at the same time and playing sounds, or something?
Yeah, I had both Firefox and Opera open and were trying them both out. I never had a problem with crashing when I had Internet Explorer and Firefox both open. Also, ctnotify.exe crashed and it is part of the soundblaster drivers. I have a soundblaster Audigy. I don't know why this crashed but it has never crashed before and the only new thing that I did recently was to install Opera and I thought it was probably related. They have not crashed again since Opera was unistalled.
Well, you could always diisable some of the sound settings in Opera and see if that helps. What sites where you visiting when the crash happened?
Google and KQIX ;)
Maybe too much Flash killed it. XD
Update Flash?
Well, I can try again later --- ;)
Yay! :D
Opera only crashes on me like once a year, mostly due to some fault of Windows. :P
Well, in the 98 general newsgroup a person suggested Sea Monkey which is by Mozilla.
http://www.mozilla.org/projects/seamonkey/
My laptop is working and I have Firefox again!! :D
Congratulations, Rosella
How did you get it working again?
It turns out the wireless card didn't want to work when it only had half of its pieces. I can't imagine why. :P
<grin>
Well, I am giving Opera another chance. :P ::) 8)
Hooray! :D
Opera now works well but I have found that I cannot do some things in Opera -- eg. check my Hotmail account
Mozilla Firefox is great but sometimes you have to use Internet Explorer if a site needs Active X.
Internet Explorer -- an old stand-bye that I try to avoid using now due to browser insecurity -- will Internet Explorer 7 do better -- we shall see
There's a download for Active X for Firefox, I believe. I havent had that probley in a long time.
I use Firefox and the Firefox plugin that allows you to render pages in IE if you wish. :)
I will have to look for information on that plug-in, Neil. 8)
It's pretty awesome. It literally switches to the IE engine for that particular page/tab. Meaning if you right click, you'll see the traditional IE options, so you can tell it is being actually opened in IE, but just encased in a Firefox toolbar and titlebar. 8)
I have it now and it is sweet. I can now use Windows Update with Firefox using the Internet Explorer engine. 8) It is just as you said. I also downloaded McAfee SiteAdvisor which tells me about the safety of different sites. For some reason, they have not rated this site yet.
Yup. I'm not sure who made that Firefox extension, but it's awesome! ;D
According to this article, Microsoft plans to make their website not compatible with Firefox.
Informationweek (http://www.informationweek.com/story/showArticle.jhtml?articleID=191100266)
Neil, can you please send me a message on how to shorten long websites so they do not cause forum stretching. Thanks, Dew!
Microsoft (http://preview.microsoft.com/en/us/default.aspx)
Dew was here (http://www.google.com)
Sure, just copy and paste this:
[url=http://www.google.com]Dew was here[/url] :P
I got it. Thank you so much. ;D
Yonkey was here (http://www.tsl-game.com/)
LOL! I actually was there too before the site died. ::)
XD
Hey, I noticied at microsoft.com I can no longer click the links with Mozilla Firefox. However, I can click all of them fine with Internet Explorer. I wonder if this is Microsoft trying to stop the huge spread of Mozilla Firefox.
I emailed Microsoft and it works again with Firefox. 8)
Hahaha, way to go! :P
Thanks Neil! The amusing thing was that Microsoft did not admit any fault and gave me the web link for Mozilla support. I decided to try and see if Mozilla Firefox worked again at the Microsoft site and sure enough it did and so I did not need any Mozilla Firefox support. It looks like Microsoft was trying to pull a fast one. ;D ::)
LOL. Yeah, sounds like it. Mozilla didn't create their site, they did. ::)
Anyway, it's good to hear that they fixed it. :)
The Beta 2 of Firefox v.2.0 is out, but I'm hesitant about installing it until the actual release of the new version.
Link (http://www.mozilla.org/projects/bonecho/all-beta.html)
Yeah, if you want to use betas I would set up a test environment to see how you like them. I would not use them on my main computer since they are still in testing stage and you are asking for trouble if you do that. ;)
Quote from: dew7 on September 01, 2006, 09:39:29 PM
Yeah, if you want to use betas I would set up a test environment to see how you like them. I would not use them on my main computer since they are still in testing stage and you are asking for trouble if you do that. ;)
Unless you're asking to beta test "Shadows", in which case you're asking for :suffer:
Quote from: TribeHasSpoken on September 01, 2006, 09:47:26 PM
Quote from: dew7 on September 01, 2006, 09:39:29 PM
Yeah, if you want to use betas I would set up a test environment to see how you like them. I would not use them on my main computer since they are still in testing stage and you are asking for trouble if you do that. ;)
Unless you're asking to beta test "Shadows", in which case you're asking for :suffer:
Now, if the team wants me to beta test "Shadows" --- no problem -- since it is a game and when it crashes it seems to only hurt itself. Now if you are using your main production line or a mission critical computer then of course not but those who download the latest Windows Media Player (11 beta currently) and/or Windows Vista (beta until January 2007 or later and/or Internet Explorer 7 (beta or Release Candidate which is still before the full regular release) are currently fools in my opinion unless they have a test computer or have set up a test environment where they can safely test this software. Don't computers have enough troubles without adding the complexities of beta software into the mix without the appropriate safeguards.
LOL!!
BTW, an interesting article on hacking and keeping your web sites safe
http://tech.msn.com/security/article.aspx?cp-documentid=830158
I don't mind beta software that much. Both the most stablest build of Firefox and IE have crashed and frozen on me before, so it's not really a huge deal if the latest version does too. ;P
Firefox's search function never seems to work properly for me on certain pages, so I'm wondering if they've fixed that.
I don't know if Firefox fixed the search function. I do know that in some parts of the Microsoft site --- I need to use Internet Explorer to render the whole page properly but this may have something to do with Active X technology in IE.
The final build of Firefox 2.0 has now been released. The most obvious update, apart from the aesthetic changes, is that the browser checks your spelling as you type. I have yet to decide if it's really useful or really annoying. I mean, the bad spelling inherent to posting on the internet has a certain charm to it. We complain about it, but would miss it if it wasn't there anymore.