Seriously, it is impossible. There is no way, absolutely no way that anyone could theoretically complete this game without a walkthrough or hintbook. There are so many dead ends in this game and so many impossible connections to make.
How could you possibly know to pick up the bone in the cave (which is needed to throw to the dog)? How could you possibly know to find the bridle behind the boat on the second small island? Hell, how could you know that you need to be swallowed by a whale? It goes on and on...but wait, there are worse!
How could you ever get through the cave/troll/crevice/weird back area with the pond without a hint guide? That's the hardest thing I've ever done in any game...period. Or how could you possibly know that the shovel breaks if you dig too many times and you're permanently stuck? ARGH!
Why is this game so hard? It's almost too hard WITH a walkthrough. I will admit, it's one of my favorite of the series...but why did they have to make such an impossible game?
If you think that's hard, try playing Leisure Suit Larry. EVIL! :(
Or even King's Quest V - there are SO many ways to screw up there!
Try King's Quest III. I had an annoyingly long time with that one. I died too many times to count. KQ4 I don't remember much from. I haven't played it in forever, so I don't remember it being too hard.... By the way, this is my first post in forever! It's been months since I was last here!
I agree with Useless. :P I mean, the bone wasn't a big deal, and a lot are typical explorative-ness, but WHAT is with that bridle!? XD There's no warning, no hints...Geez. It makes me wonder if ANYONE actually finished it without hints. :P
My dad thinks that there is no possible way to beat any King's Quest or any adventure game for that matter without the use for a strategy guide. He believes MoE is one such example. I like strategy guides anyway! Some friends of mine think that strategy guides is a form of cheating. I don't think it is.
Useless has a point... KQ4 (and KQ3, for that matter) has absurdly difficult parts, to the point of being downright unfair.
However, I seem to recall some people (on this forum, probably) claiming they've finished those games without a walkthrough, so who knows... ;)
Quote from: Boogeyman on February 25, 2007, 12:02:39 AM
Or even King's Quest V - there are SO many ways to screw up there!
KQ5 may have had lots of dead ends, but it wasn't as unfair as previous KQ. Maybe it's just the point & click interface, but figuring you have to use the hook on the mouse hole to get the cheese still isn't as bad as figuring you have to "look ground" while standing inside the boat wreck :-\
Also, most dead ends in KQ5 are not unfair, and can easily be avoided by a seasoned adventurer. The cat got the mouse before you could react? it's obvious you need to restore and see what you need to do there. Ignored a hungry eagle on your way? you should know that'll come back to bite you ;)
The only truly unfair part in KQ5, as far as I recall, is where you have to wait in Mordack's study till he falls asleep. There is about 0% chance you'll say to yourself "hey, let's stand here for a while and do nothing, maybe he'll decide to take a nap". The only way to get through this part without a walkthrough is the dumb luck of taking a bathroom break while forgetting to pause the game ::)
Quote from: uselessidguy331 on February 24, 2007, 05:41:04 PMWhy is this game so hard? It's almost too hard WITH a walkthrough. I will admit, it's one of my favorite of the series...but why did they have to make such an impossible game?
My guess? They were making lots and lots of money on the hint hotline and selling strategy guides ;P
Quote from: Storm on February 26, 2007, 05:03:37 PM
The only truly unfair part in KQ5, as far as I recall, is where you have to wait in Mordack's study till he falls asleep. There is about 0% chance you'll say to yourself "hey, let's stand here for a while and do nothing, maybe he'll decide to take a nap".
Was there any clue that you had to put the cheese in the wand machine thing other than being one of your few inventory items left? Cause that seemed kinda random to me.
Quote from: Storm on February 26, 2007, 05:03:37 PM
The only way to get through this part without a walkthrough is the dumb luck of taking a bathroom break while forgetting to pause the game ::)
Is that from personal experience? ;P
Quote from: Storm on February 26, 2007, 05:03:37 PM
Quote from: uselessidguy331 on February 24, 2007, 05:41:04 PMWhy is this game so hard? It's almost too hard WITH a walkthrough. I will admit, it's one of my favorite of the series...but why did they have to make such an impossible game?
My guess? They were making lots and lots of money on the hint hotline and selling strategy guides ;P
That would not surprise me one little bit.
Further reason to be angry over King's Quest four: the inventory gives you absolutely no hint as to how many times you can use an object. This has twice, now, cost me my game with only a short portion left to play---argh!
First off, when I tried playing the game again a few years ago, I dug once too many with the shovel and, yes, you guessed it, it broke and I was stuck with nowhere to go and nothing to do but start over.
But wait, it gets worse. I tried to beat it again just a week ago and, after working my way through steadily over the course of the week, I got to the end...only to realize that, MY GOD, I had no arrows left to kill Lollette at the end because, apparently, you can only shoot two effing arrows the whole game. Absolutely mindblowing stuff here.
The game was classic, but some parts are just head-scratchingly hard.
I finished KQIV and III without a hintbook. It kind of makes sense because at the time of the release of those games....guides were not widely available where I live (Greece).
Another good thing about not having walkthroughs, was the fact that the games actually took me days to finish and forced me to think of ways and things that i may have missed, which basically enabled me to actually enjoy them more.
My 2 cents..
Quote from: Oreldwin on February 27, 2007, 06:04:12 PM
I finished KQIV and III without a hintbook.
Aha! I knew there was someone here who did. Guess I'm not that senile after all ;D
Quote from: tessspoon on February 26, 2007, 05:13:07 PMWas there any clue that you had to put the cheese in the wand machine thing other than being one of your few inventory items left? Cause that seemed kinda random to me.
There was no clue, but you don't always get clues for every single thing you have to do. Some games make you do things that seem illogical, so when logic fails I take the "try everything on everything" approach. Sure, it might look random, but as far as I'm concerned it's still pretty fair.
Quote from: tessspoon on February 26, 2007, 05:13:07 PM
Quote from: Storm on February 26, 2007, 05:03:37 PMThe only way to get through this part without a walkthrough is the dumb luck of taking a bathroom break while forgetting to pause the game ::)
Is that from personal experience? ;P
Well... let's say I don't remember the exact circumstances, but it was probably due to inadvertently staying in that room too long rather than some stroke of brilliance ;P
Quote from: uselessidguy331 on February 26, 2007, 10:58:27 PM
...apparently, you can only shoot two effing arrows the whole game. Absolutely mindblowing stuff here.
You're right about the shovel, but doesn't the bow's inventory picture show you only have two arrows (IIRC it even changes according to the number of arrows you have left)? :-\
I agree that finding the bridal is tough and I needed a hint to find out about that in the game but if you think about it then it would make sense for something big to be on the island after you found your way out of the whale. I always had lots of saved games with adventure games like King's Quest because you could easily miss an item and then you could restore to an earlier game without restarting the game. How about King's Quest 5 where you would need to know to get the gem to disable the serpent's eyes and would have to restore to that point if you did not pick up the gem.
I don't know why people think that KQ3 is impossible without a hint book.
I got that game for my 9th birthday. I beat the game before my 10th birthday. I then tried for a perfect score. I had an almost perfect score for years. I was only missing the 3 dried acorns. It wasn't until I was 13 years old that I finally found those stupid acorns. I tried looking under and around the acorn tree (bandits tree) a thousand times! I just never stood in the exact right spot until 4 years after I got the game!!
I like the fact that King Quest games are so hard and on the verge of being impossible. That is what got me addicted and is why I'm on this forum now.
I still believe the King's Quest series to be one of the all time greatest adventure series of all time.
I actually like KQ1-KQ3 the most because I had to figure out exactly what to type because the point and click hadn't been incorporated into these games yet.
If the King's Quest Series wasn't hard, or on the verge of impossible, I doubt that many people on this forum would be here today!
Quote from: flamdrag on March 13, 2007, 08:20:22 PMI don't know why people think that KQ3 is impossible without a hint book.
For me, it's mostly because of having to "look above" to find the key to the wand locker. There's absolutely no clue for its being there, so I don't think I could have figured that out myself. The rest of the stuff I think I could have solved, given enough time (10 years or so) ;)
Quote from: flamdrag on March 13, 2007, 08:20:22 PMI tried looking under and around the acorn tree (bandits tree) a thousand times! I just never stood in the exact right spot until 4 years after I got the game!!
I thought that was a random thing rather than a specific area you should be standing in :-\ At least with the acorns you get a clue telling you to pick them up, since they're in the spell recipe.
Quote from: flamdrag on March 13, 2007, 08:20:22 PM
I like the fact that King Quest games are so hard and on the verge of being impossible. That is what got me addicted and is why I'm on this forum now...
If the King's Quest Series wasn't hard, or on the verge of impossible, I doubt that many people on this forum would be here today!
I used a walkthrough for King's Quest 1-4, so I'm pretty sure I still would have been here ;)
I don't think difficulty is the reason people like King's Quest so much. Most fans consider KQ6 the best game in the series and while not easy, it's far from being impossible. Some people might enjoy spending hours looking for the right word and have no problem with those "unfair" puzzles, but many others would just get too frustrated and resort to a walkthrough, or quit playing altogether.
Personally, I don't mind difficult puzzles, just unfair ones - the kind that involves pixel/word hunting or doing things no reasonable person would have thought of for no reason whatsoever.
To quote a higher authority on the subject:
QuoteArbitrary puzzles
Puzzles and their solutions need to make sense. They don't have to be obvious, just make sense. The best reaction after solving a tough puzzle should be, "Of course, why didn't I think of that sooner!" The worst, and most often heard after being told the solution is, "I never would have gotten that!" If the solution can only be reached by trial and error or plain luck, it's a bad puzzle.
For the full article: http://grumpygamer.com/adventuregames
I agree with LN that some text games were really difficult and think you had to use your imagination to paint the picture in your mind and then come to conclusions from what you saw in your mind as to how to solve the puzzle. I kind of like the parser interface where you had to type to solve puzzles as compared to the modern point and click. The point and click interface just seems to be lacking from some of the other games like King's Quest 4. ;)
Quote from: dark-daventry on February 26, 2007, 03:05:52 PM
Try King's Quest III. I had an annoyingly long time with that one. I died too many times to count. KQ4 I don't remember much from. I haven't played it in forever, so I don't remember it being too hard.... By the way, this is my first post in forever! It's been months since I was last here!
Haha My nieces love the KQ games so I have been playing the games with them and we got to KQ 3 and they couldn't take it because they are only allowed 30 minutes of screen time a day and even using the walkthroughs on www.gamefaqs.com we were having a hard time. Several of them say break dough into 2 pieces but it does not understand break or 2 we got it using divide and two but still. Yeesh
King's Quest V had tow major problems mazes and pitfalls. I had to draw a map of the Desert, which is so **** hard when you collapse every three screens.
And the pitfalls, GAWD, the pitfalls. Like feeding the eagle pie instead of the ham. Or missing one of numerous little sparkly things will something is trying to eat you (everything wants to eat the royal family for some reason).
There are many, many other examples.
Quote from: Bludshot on March 23, 2007, 03:12:35 PM
And the pitfalls, GAWD, the pitfalls. Like feeding the eagle pie instead of the ham. Or missing one of numerous little sparkly things will something is trying to eat you (everything wants to eat the royal family for some reason).
That's why a lot of people at GameFAQS consider KQ5 to be barbaric.
Quote from: Dangling on March 23, 2007, 10:11:37 AM
Quote from: dark-daventry on February 26, 2007, 03:05:52 PM
Try King's Quest III. I had an annoyingly long time with that one. I died too many times to count. KQ4 I don't remember much from. I haven't played it in forever, so I don't remember it being too hard.... By the way, this is my first post in forever! It's been months since I was last here!
Haha My nieces love the KQ games so I have been playing the games with them and we got to KQ 3 and they couldn't take it because they are only allowed 30 minutes of screen time a day and even using the walkthroughs on www.gamefaqs.com we were having a hard time. Several of them say break dough into 2 pieces but it does not understand break or 2 we got it using divide and two but still. Yeesh
The recent collection of KQ games used the same manual as the 1997 collection, which has instruction errors for some of those spells. I had to check out the Vivendi Forums to finally finish the invisibilty spell.
The spells you had to get exactly or you would lose the game. I am surprised that Sierra did not fix the errors in the manual with this release. King's Quest 5 was difficult. A great example is that you had to get Cassima's locket quickly and if you did not have it then you could not finish the game.
Or the cheese in dungeon.
I must admit to still having NEVER finished KQ3...It's the first adventure game I ever played and I never owned it, I always played bits and pieces at a 2nd cousins years back.....I'm going to attempt it without a hintbook, but having not played a game that hard for years, I dunno how successful I'll be.
And the worst bit of KQ4 for me(though I think I cheated quite a bit after this) was figuring out how to climb up the STUPID whale tongue. My mom, sister, and I kind of played KQ4 together way back when, and that one had us stuck literally for months. I should point out we ordered the hint book from Sierra because of it and it didn't help since it didn't give specific intruction(from what I remember) for climbing it....but everytime we got stuck too long on a puzzle after that, we found it far too tempting to cheat and ended up using the hintbook on other puzzles, fairly often.
Strangely, KQ3 has very few if any pitfalls. But of course it does have its share of annoying challenges (like knowing you have to just stand there in the pirate ship until it reaches land).
That was the only thing that really annoyed me with KQIII was the time issue and you having to wait for the wizard to leave and also wait for a while in the ship especially after you had solved the puzzles and were playing it again.
I found King's Quest 5 to be the most difficult in the series. The mazes in the desert and Mordack's castle were difficult. In addition, it was easy to miss something or do something wrong and not find out until later such as not getting Cassima's locket or as someone else has mentioned feeding the eagle with the pie instead of the meat. Which King's Quest was the most difficult for you and why
;)
I agree; KQV was difficult due to the mazes and the countless dead ends, but I recall probably dying the most often in KQVIII and must thus conclude that that also had a certain level of difficulty though it doesn't seem it when thinking of the plot.
I don't know about difficult, but for me, KQIII was definitely the most frustrating. For one thing, I would never have thought to hide anything under my bed without looking up the hints. It also took me FOREVER to figure out I that was supposed to move that giant book to open up the trap door. But what I hated most of all was that I kept messing up the spells, because the manual was worded incorrectly quite a few times. I hated how you couldn't look away from the spellbook without dying... a few times, I would accidentally save instead of restore my game when I realized I didn't have an ingrediant, so I'd have to start all over again.