Author Topic: Why is KQ6 your favorite KQ?  (Read 26393 times)

Offline Lambonius

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Re: Why is KQ6 your favorite KQ?
« Reply #20 on: March 21, 2011, 11:08:05 PM »
The way I see it, being a KQ fanboy/girl because of KQ6 is kind of like saying you're a Miles Davis fan but only owning Kind of Blue.   ;)

Offline Cez

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Re: Why is KQ6 your favorite KQ?
« Reply #21 on: March 22, 2011, 07:15:21 AM »
The way I see it, being a KQ fanboy/girl because of KQ6 is kind of like saying you're a Miles Davis fan but only owning Kind of Blue.   ;)

Not everyone can live up to your high standards, I suppose :P

I played KQ6 first (I had played 3 a while before when I was a kid but only at my cousin's house.) It was such an involving game that I just couldn't stop playing it. KQ5 may have been pretty and all, but the game was crappy --it frustrated me at best. Liking KQ5 over KQ6 is a matter of nostalgia and preferring King Graham, because there's nothing subjective about KQ6 being a better game. KQ5 is the perfect Sierra fan dream. But heck, any other King's Quest was better gameplay wise than 5. 5 is just very special in people's heart because it started the VGA era. I, on the other hand, experienced the start of the VGA era with SQ4 (which is why I love it so much).

Great music, very different characters, very different lands, a sense of the world as it was built by levels, two different paths to the end, a great love story, and exciting ending sequence that starts once you disrupt the wedding. What's there not to like?


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Re: Why is KQ6 your favorite KQ?
« Reply #22 on: March 22, 2011, 08:40:25 AM »
The way I see it, being a KQ fanboy/girl because of KQ6 is kind of like saying you're a Miles Davis fan but only owning Kind of Blue.   ;)

Not everyone can live up to your high standards, I suppose :P

I played KQ6 first (I had played 3 a while before when I was a kid but only at my cousin's house.) It was such an involving game that I just couldn't stop playing it. KQ5 may have been pretty and all, but the game was crappy --it frustrated me at best. Liking KQ5 over KQ6 is a matter of nostalgia and preferring King Graham, because there's nothing subjective about KQ6 being a better game. KQ5 is the perfect Sierra fan dream. But heck, any other King's Quest was better gameplay wise than 5. 5 is just very special in people's heart because it started the VGA era. I, on the other hand, experienced the start of the VGA era with SQ4 (which is why I love it so much).

Great music, very different characters, very different lands, a sense of the world as it was built by levels, two different paths to the end, a great love story, and exciting ending sequence that starts once you disrupt the wedding. What's there not to like?


Actually, I'd think there WAS something subjective about KQ6 being a better game. Art isn't something easily defined in any real objective sense. For example, an action gamer might argue the MERITs of action games over adventure games, but that doesn't make action games better in any real sense; simply better in his/her perspective.

I think saying that the only reason one would prefer KQ5 is "nostalgia" kind of belittles the people--Like most of the people over at IA, for example, myself, and others who DO prefer KQ5, and not simply because it started the VGA era. Personally while KQ5 is probably my all time favorite KQ game, I consider SQ1VGA one of the best games of the VGA era, after it coming Conquests of the Longbow.

Any other KQ game was better than KQ5? Really? So, the original KQ2 was better? KQ7 with all of it's non-interactivity? KQ8?

I would argue that KQ5 had great music and could even name many of the game's pieces of music which I feel outshine any KQ6 music. KQ5 also has a wild variety of characters--from the fun and bright to the dark and strange and everything in between. Serenia is one Kingdom, yes, but each part of the realm is VERY different from any other. One part of the land is a desert wasteland, the other a realm of ice and snow; There's the beach; the Dark Forest; the Harpie Island, and finally Mordack's castle--All perhaps the most fascinating places in any of the KQ games. Two paths to the end? Meh the whole multiple ending thing is kind of silly and reminds me of those "Choose Your Own Adventure" books. I think a story has one, definitive ending.

A great love story? I'm not a big fan of romance stories, personally. And for all the writing in KQ6, the love story could've been written better IMO. The ending? I find the whole ending of KQ5 to be exciting and thrilling--Silently searching around Mordack's creepy castle, in danger of being grabbed any minute by the Blue Beast, having to evade the eyes of Manannan and bag him, and finally that magical battle--For me the ending of KQ5 with it's almost poetic quality; Winged Creature against Lion; Dragon against rabbit; Snake against Mongoose; and finally, fire against water. It's almost poetic in that sense and it ends triumphant, yet not overdone. KQ6's best ending kind of reminds me of the "Mega Happy Ending" of Wayne's World.

I also feel the world in KQ5 FEELS larger than in KQ6. It may not be bigger by screens, but it feels like you're a little man in a large world. I always wanted to know more about Serenia, more about the little islands off in the distance, more abut the little hut village just beyond the snowy mountains that we see but never interact with. There is nothing in KQ6 that in terms of the lands that really captures and fires the imagination. KQ6 is largely contained in a small environment, and all o the islands are rather small themselves, and travelling back and forth from island to island throughout the game gets repetitive and a bit boring after a while. I like going from Point A to Point B to Point C, not going from Point A to Point C to Point A to Point B to Point C to point A again.

Also, I love the fact that KQ5 is so random. It doesn't take itself too seriously and is enjoyable by both kids and adults alike in this matter. It's incredibly original. I mean what other game has something the character defeating a monster by throwing a pie in it's face? It's just so random that it's brilliant. The game throws everything that's possibly random at you and challenges you again and again.

The lighter moments in KQ6 feel too structured, the puns and whatnot make a little too much sense, it's a little too calculated. I mean you slay the Minotaur by showing him the red scarf...How..um clever? The Hole in the Wall is LITERALLY a living hole in a wall. The Book Worm is LITERALLY a worm who lives in books. It's a little too overwrought and overthought---which is a flaw I find common with a lot of Jane Jensen's games.

Also, I feel in the larger context of the series, KQ6 with it's darkness sticks out like a sore thumb, especially if you take each game at face value. Every KQ game at face value is generally more or less lighthearted, with some serious moments. Every KQ game has an element of surprise and randomness; Random encounters and creatures, whereas in KQ6 it feels all planned out, thought out, and thus a little sterile. KQ6 sticks out with it's political intrigue, murders, and overall VERY serious tone. I mean we go from throwing pies at Yetis in one game...To making Death himself cry in the next. That's a pretty big jump.

It's like one of those old math problems: "Which of these is not like the others?"
A) An evil witch driving around in the batmobile with the batman theme music playing
B) Every character both good and bad showing up at the end, despite whether they're dead or not.
C) Defeating a yeti with a pie and activating a magical machine with Cheese
D) You help out Dwarves by cleaning their house for them and share soup with them and a minstrel plays horrid out of tune songs.
E) Meeting the Lord of the Dead and making him cry.

The light hearted moments in KQ6 end up feeling a little disconcerting as the game breaks it's serious atmosphere by having light hearted moments which are painfully lighthearted, and feel forced; It feels like those light hearted moments were just shoved in there since lightheartedness is expected in a KQ game. It makes the game feel uneven, as if it doesn't know whether it wants to be a dark, serious, mature game...or a family friendly childish game. It feels kind of bipolar in that respect.

Case in point, the Isle of the Dead. You have a creepy, spine tingling realm full of restless spirits, rotting shuffling zombies who are obviously in some cases murder victims, the land you're standing on looks like it's made of flesh and an ominous full moon hangs over the sky. You've got a great, dark, spooky atmosphere worked up here...And it's shattered in one moment by the Dem Bones gag which detracts from the overall seriousness of the scene. It feels like it was thrown in there at the last minute to lighten things up a bit. Like somebody perhaps thought, "You know, this is getting a bit too dark for a KQ game, don't you think we should lighten up a little?"

It and KQ8 are two very big breaks in the formula of the series; KQ6 in tone and writing; KQ8 in tone and gameplay. Even KQ8 for all of it's non-traditional elements retains a fairly simple yet grand plot. KQ6's plot is a little too Byzantine for my tastes.

Offline Rado

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Re: Why is KQ6 your favorite KQ?
« Reply #23 on: March 22, 2011, 08:52:47 AM »
While V is my favorite as far as tone goes (and there's no nostalgia involved as I played it after KQVI), I don't understand why VI is considered to be the darkest of the series or even dark at all. To me, it has a tone of a fable, or rather a collection of fables, each different than the last. I'm not sure what in KQ VI is "worse" than the haunted house or the witches from IV, not the mention the entirety of III, which was depressing as hell and had entirely different structure and pacing than any other game in the series.

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Re: Why is KQ6 your favorite KQ?
« Reply #24 on: March 22, 2011, 09:18:39 AM »
While V is my favorite as far as tone goes (and there's no nostalgia involved as I played it after KQVI), I don't understand why VI is considered to be the darkest of the series or even dark at all. To me, it has a tone of a fable, or rather a collection of fables, each different than the last. I'm not sure what in KQ VI is "worse" than the haunted house or the witches from IV, not the mention the entirety of III, which was depressing as hell and had entirely different structure and pacing than any other game in the series.

I'll agree with you that III has a different structure and pacing from the other games; I think this was intentional--Roberta wanted to confuse people and get them to think, "Huh?". She was challenging herself here. And it worked because She received angry letters from customers who hadn't complete the game complaining that it wasn't a real KQ game--"Who is this Gwydion, and why should we care about him? He's not a King, or connected with King Graham. Speaking of which, where is King Graham? Where's Daventry? Magic spells? This ain't King's Quest!" Roberta later claimed she even got some flack from religious groups who felt KQ3 promoted Satanism by having you make spells.

Remember, this was the mid 1980s--The time period when Dungeons & Dragons was being blamed for kids becoming murderers and cultists and there was the minor (now nearly forgotten) public hysteria over Satanism by the religious right and a furor over Heavy Metal music with claims it promoted suicide, violence and Satanism. For it's time, KQ3 was a bit risque in that regard.

But I disagree about it being depressing. Yes, if you really take a critical and analytical eye to the plot, it's a dark one with it's themes of slavery, a kingdom in ruins, etc. A lot of the KQ games are actually dark if you look them analytically, with an adult sort of mind, even the bright and sunny KQ5. If you really think about the plots, some of them are quite dark. But the same goes for the original fairy tales the games were based on, too. But that's the whole point--King's Quest was never meant to be taken all that seriously, and was never meant to be serious material. It's played largely for laughs and is, at face value, a light hearted, family friendly experienced. It's only Rock N' Roll, you know? It's only King's Quest, not Lord of the Rings.

When playing KQ3 and taking it at face value, the atmosphere/tone conveyed conveyed isn't really one of darkness. The idea of Manannan being a slave isn't played too seriously or too darkly (I mean one of Manannan's punishments is to make you exercise and campy 80s style exercise music plays; I always thought him turning you in a snail was funny, even at a young age) and you've got happy, funny moments like the three bears and the town and being on the ship, and the triumphant ending.
« Last Edit: March 22, 2011, 09:20:35 AM by Sir Perceval of Daventry »

Offline snabbott

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Re: Why is KQ6 your favorite KQ?
« Reply #25 on: March 22, 2011, 09:36:37 AM »
The light hearted moments in KQ6 end up feeling a little disconcerting as the game breaks it's serious atmosphere by having light hearted moments which are painfully lighthearted, and feel forced; It feels like those light hearted moments were just shoved in there since lightheartedness is expected in a KQ game. It makes the game feel uneven, as if it doesn't know whether it wants to be a dark, serious, mature game...or a family friendly childish game. It feels kind of bipolar in that respect.
Ever heard of catharsis?

I do see where you're coming from. Obviously, different people have different tastes. I thought KQ5 and KQ6 were both great games, but I did prefer KQ6.

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Re: Why is KQ6 your favorite KQ?
« Reply #26 on: March 22, 2011, 10:00:39 AM »
The light hearted moments in KQ6 end up feeling a little disconcerting as the game breaks it's serious atmosphere by having light hearted moments which are painfully lighthearted, and feel forced; It feels like those light hearted moments were just shoved in there since lightheartedness is expected in a KQ game. It makes the game feel uneven, as if it doesn't know whether it wants to be a dark, serious, mature game...or a family friendly childish game. It feels kind of bipolar in that respect.
Ever heard of catharsis?

I do see where you're coming from. Obviously, different people have different tastes. I thought KQ5 and KQ6 were both great games, but I did prefer KQ6.

Yeah, I just think it was kind of a incongruous mix of styles, which play out roughly against each other. Roberta and Jane are two VERY different writers with two very different visions, very different influences and mindsets, and even two very different ways of going about designing a game. Basically you had two women who seem to be for all intents and purposes, polar opposites designing the same game. And it kind of not works here because you can tell it's sort of a push and shove between these two styles clashing. Jane wanted it her way, Roberta wanted it her own but kept her distance as she was tired of KQ and was busy writing Phantasmagoria.

KQ7 works better in terms of it being a collaboration between Roberta and another designer because Lorelei Shannon tried in many ways to emulate Roberta, and did exactly what Roberta intended: Created a Disney-esque KQ game. She didn't try to inject her own very different style, story ideas and writing into a well established series which had it's own tone and "rules". There's a certain amount of respect on Lorelei's part for what was established by the original creator which I feel Jane lacked.

It kind of feels like KQ6 was as much a testing ground for GK on Jane's part as it was an experience as being a co-designer. There's some elements which KQ6 has in common with GK in terms of pacing, gameplay and tone which is only held in place by Roberta's influence and the brand name and the expectations that came with it. It's just an uneven game, a nice experiment in a different style. Kind of like Temple of Doom was for Indiana Jones.
« Last Edit: March 22, 2011, 10:02:13 AM by Sir Perceval of Daventry »

Offline Cez

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Re: Why is KQ6 your favorite KQ?
« Reply #27 on: March 22, 2011, 12:00:19 PM »
Everything else is subjective, but gameplay wise, yes, I do think KQ5 is one of the worse, even worse than MoE. MoE didn't frustrate me by having me reload a 3 hours ago game because I ran into a dead end. KQ5 did.

And that just stained whatever good experience I could have had of the game.

As for everything else, I won't argue. Those are the reasons why I loved KQ6. I'm not going to debate them because it's all very subjective.


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Offline wilco64256

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Re: Why is KQ6 your favorite KQ?
« Reply #28 on: March 22, 2011, 01:38:39 PM »
I have to agree that KQ5 is the worst in the series for dead ends (in my opinion, anyway).  If not for those it would be much more popular.
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Offline Blackthorne

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Re: Why is KQ6 your favorite KQ?
« Reply #29 on: March 22, 2011, 01:55:12 PM »
I think the Miles Davis analogy is a good one.  Mostly because I love Live/Evil, Bitches Brew and On The Corner more than I like Kind of Blue.  They're all very different.  Kind of Blue is a 180 from Bitches Brew - one's a very standard Jazz album - the kind one thinks of when they think of "Jazz".  And ones is a crazy, cacophanous experiment to the broad edges of fusion - rock and jazz meeting in a jam with a huge amount of musicians.  Just majorly different - and both Miles.

I think Kind of Blue is good, but a little safe and bland compared to something like "On The Corner".  It's how I feel about KQVI.  It seems like its this deep, dark, intense tale - but it relies so much on standard "dark" cliches, that it comes off as lame to half the time.  For an intense game, it's pretty safe.


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Offline Lambonius

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Re: Why is KQ6 your favorite KQ?
« Reply #30 on: March 22, 2011, 02:18:12 PM »
I think the Miles Davis analogy is a good one.  Mostly because I love Live/Evil, b****es Brew and On The Corner more than I like Kind of Blue.  They're all very different.  Kind of Blue is a 180 from b****es Brew - one's a very standard Jazz album - the kind one thinks of when they think of "Jazz".  And ones is a crazy, cacophanous experiment to the broad edges of fusion - rock and jazz meeting in a jam with a huge amount of musicians.  Just majorly different - and both Miles.

I think Kind of Blue is good, but a little safe and bland compared to something like "On The Corner".  It's how I feel about KQVI.  It seems like its this deep, dark, intense tale - but it relies so much on standard "dark" cliches, that it comes off as lame to half the time.  For an intense game, it's pretty safe.


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Ha!  I was hoping at least ONE person would get the Miles analogy.  Kind of Blue is a great, great album, but it only scratches the surface of what makes Miles great.  And in a lot of ways, like you said, it's one of his safest and most accessible albums to the casual listener.  Personally, I'm a big fan of Sketches of Spain and In a Silent Way, but yeah B:tch's Brew is awesome, too.  I also have a sh:tload of his live performances, too.  Good stuff.

BTW, I also played KQ5 after KQ6, and let me just say, I've ALWAYS liked it best.  Always.  For most of the reasons listed above.  Percival summed a lot of my feelings up pretty well, though I think I hold less animosity towards KQ6 than he does.  :)

I just think KQ6 is the safe choice.  Personally, I love that you can get screwed in KQ5.  I love that the game doesn't pull any punches, doesn't lead you by the hand, and isn't afraid to check you in the balls when you least expect it.  For people looking for a kinder, gentler experience, I can see why they like KQ6 more.  It's just not my own preference.  I relish the challenge of a game like KQ5.
« Last Edit: March 22, 2011, 02:32:00 PM by Lambonius »

Offline Arkillian

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Re: Why is KQ6 your favorite KQ?
« Reply #31 on: March 22, 2011, 03:29:31 PM »
I just think KQ6 is the safe choice.  Personally, I love that you can get screwed in KQ5.  I love that the game doesn't pull any punches, doesn't lead you by the hand, and isn't afraid to check you in the balls when you least expect it.  For people looking for a kinder, gentler experience, I can see why they like KQ6 more.  It's just not my own preference.  I relish the challenge of a game like KQ5.

I don't mind dead ends either. There isn't that many dead ends- mostly surprise deaths. I think the worst is not getting the cheese. Cedric and the Harpies requires the most back tracking, but really, if people didn't see that Graham is not meant to be a heartless ass then they deserved to get zotted by Mordack. I must admit, KQ5 had more epic moments in it, but that doesn't mean that KQ6's storyline wasn't as epic. It's like telling a story of 2 different genres. If you told me a western story about cowboys and indians, I'd be bored to tears. Tell me a fantasy romance story and I'd be fawning. That is the difference to me. KQ5 was a very action story, and KQ6 was romantic. If you're not into a more romantic story then you wouldn't like it. I loved both. I just love KQ6 abit more :)

(And Cedric is SO much more tolerant without a voice. Do KQ5 text only and Cedric is actually an entertaining companion to have. Sadly you miss out on Graham, and Mordack's voice, but I'd happily sacrifice that)


Offline Big C from Cauney island

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Re: Why is KQ6 your favorite KQ?
« Reply #32 on: March 22, 2011, 04:01:35 PM »
Kq6 is my favorite in the series, though for a long time it was kq5.  As to why? Good question.  I think that kq6 did a better job with building up the characters, and making you want to follow them.  In kq5, it was mostly graham focused, if this makes sense.  The genie, alhazred, and others seemed more distinct, and therefore the game seemed bigger to me. The characters felt like they had more to them.  Also, the music played a big role like it does in TSL. 

Technically, I still think KQ3 was a better adventure, due to finding out so much at the end, and knowing so little to begin with. It REALLY challenged you.  KQ6 did as well, I just think 3 did more so.  However, as mentioned above, KQ6 felt better in terms of how everything came together.

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Re: Why is KQ6 your favorite KQ?
« Reply #33 on: March 22, 2011, 04:10:58 PM »
I never ran into a dead end in KQ5. I guess I'm just a very observant adventurer.

KQ6 was better developed, and I guess that can mean it's the better game. But I don't favour KQ5 for it's nostalgia. I favour it because it was a great experience for me (dead end-less). It really seemed like a bigger and longer journey than KQ6 ever did. It started with one large locked-in area and once you solved all the puzzles of that area you moved onto another one. And then when you solved that one you moved to another one. It was fantastic. It really was a journey and a true adventure and I loved that about the game.

And it has the best King's Quest soundtrack out of all of them. KQ6 does come close, though. With KQ1SCI following behind in third.

Offline Cez

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Re: Why is KQ6 your favorite KQ?
« Reply #34 on: March 22, 2011, 05:18:56 PM »
I actually rank very low.

For me it would be something like this:

KQ6
KQ7
KQ4
KQ1
And then everything blurs, so KQ5 is here somewhere.


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Re: Why is KQ6 your favorite KQ?
« Reply #35 on: March 22, 2011, 05:29:02 PM »
For me:

KQ5
KQ4
KQ7
KQ1SCI
KQ8/KQ2
KQ1AGI
KQ6
KQ3

I'm not really fond of Alex as a hero and I feel his adventures tend to be the weakest entries.
« Last Edit: March 22, 2011, 05:55:02 PM by Sir Perceval of Daventry »

Offline Lambonius

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Re: Why is KQ6 your favorite KQ?
« Reply #36 on: March 22, 2011, 05:38:06 PM »
Why do I feel like this thread is devolving into a Cez vs, Sir Percival grudge match?

Offline Cez

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Re: Why is KQ6 your favorite KQ?
« Reply #37 on: March 22, 2011, 05:46:44 PM »
lol, actually I find it funny that we both agree on everything else and then KQ5 and KQ6 are exchanged.


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Offline Klitos

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Re: Why is KQ6 your favorite KQ?
« Reply #38 on: March 22, 2011, 05:47:42 PM »
I like that KQ5 feels more epic. And there's a couple of themes in KQ5 which are just awesome, the weeping tree is one of my favorite pieces of music. I'm with MI on this one, I never had a problem with dead ends. Even when I encountered them. As I always say, if you don't want random deaths and dead ends, play a LucasArts game. I think complaining about them in Sierra games is like King Canute commanding the sea. Okay, that analogy doesn't make sense, but I've been saving it for a long time.

I love KQ5.

I love KQ6 too.

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Re: Why is KQ6 your favorite KQ?
« Reply #39 on: March 22, 2011, 05:51:21 PM »
Why can't we all just get along?

Because this is the INTERNET, dammit!  :furious:




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