Author Topic: KQ8 in retrospect  (Read 12900 times)

Offline Rock Knight

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Re: KQ8 in retrospect
« Reply #20 on: December 01, 2015, 07:57:39 PM »
SQ5 actually altered Roger's character more than SQ6 did. Roger as presented in SQ4 is a doofus, self-centered and definitely the opposite of an alpha male. He even gets friend zoned by the Latex Babes. He clumsily saves the day. He's a goof. He's presented similarly in all the games except 5. And 5 is the only game written by Mark Crowe, who had mostly done graphics in the other games. SQ5 is a good game, I enjoy it, but it's more a parody of Star Trek than a SQ game. I never liked the idea of Roger Wilco as Captain, it kinda ruins the entire premise of the series (average Joe, semi-competent average Joe, saves the day). It'd be like seeing John McClane become Captain of the police force rather being than your average, borderline alcoholic cop; It ruins the everyman appeal of the character. I never saw Roger as this hero in the traditional sense of the word which SQ5 presents him as; he's more the right guy who happens to show up at the wrong time and gets wrapped into events beyond his control. I mean, in SQ1, we're told he's not even a competent janitor who would've been sacked if the Arcada had been nearer to home. He's not Captain material; and nothing in any of the other games ever suggested such.

I also feel SQ5 introduced Beatrice waaay too soon and hamstrung any future entries. SQ6 was a return to the series' roots, a return to form, and it features the acidic wit and writing of Scott Murphy alongside that of Josh Mandel. It was a return to form. The only downside of the game was the cliff-hanger ending, but who in 1995 could've predicted that Ken would suddenly decide adventure games were dead and sell the company off?

Offline Jack Stryker

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Re: KQ8 in retrospect
« Reply #21 on: December 01, 2015, 09:23:55 PM »
It'd be like seeing John McClane become Captain of the police force rather being than your average, borderline alcoholic cop

You mean the John McClane who was way more competent than the entire LAPD?

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Offline GrahamRocks!

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Re: KQ8 in retrospect
« Reply #22 on: December 02, 2015, 12:18:38 AM »
You kiddin' me?! SQ5 is my favorite one of the bunch for exactly that reason! I honestly loved that Roger got some actual character growth and development, and you know what that did? It made me LIKE Roger! I'll say it right now, I don't like SQ4 at all and I don't like Roger really in any of the previous games all that much because they either make him an idiot or completely flat with no personality at all. And the latter in an adventure game makes me not really care.

Yes, a doofus character can be funny. But that's all they are. That doesn't make me root for them. That doesn't make me care. That doesn't make me like them as a character. And while I like SQ6, I really dislike that they act like 5 never freaking happened and just try to uphold the precious, precious "status quo" and strip Roger (literally) of his rank as Captain.

And come on, really? With the reveal of Beatrice in the last game, I just knew they were going to introduce her soon in the next game. It's kinda like the lowly peasant catching the eye of a princess. It's not like it's love at first sight for her, and as for Roger he wants to be with her obviously, but he does have trouble doing it until he saves her life.

Offline Numbers

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Re: KQ8 in retrospect
« Reply #23 on: December 02, 2015, 10:40:07 AM »
Pretty much what GrahamRocks said. SQ5 gave us some much-needed character development for Roger Wilco, and he finally came into his own, in spite of everything around him. SQ4 and SQ6 were both awful because Roger was completely unlikable in them (not to mention terrible voice acting and puzzles in both). SQ5 actually gave him a chance to prove himself. Consider the SQ fangames that have come out; Vohaul Strikes Back was vastly inferior to Incinerations, because while it did have funny stuff in it, it wasn't the same brand of humor that the main series had, and Roger's idiocy was way over-the-top, to the point that you wonder why Beatrice puts up with him. Incinerations showed Roger finally growing a pair and stepping up to the plate. Who cares if he's not an everyman by that point? There have been plenty of previous games portraying him as a loser, and it's time for him to man up and take on a challenge.
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Offline Bludshot

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Re: KQ8 in retrospect
« Reply #24 on: December 02, 2015, 11:43:51 AM »
I don't think I ever made it past SQ4 but his doofus shtick was starting to get stale. So it's nice to know they actually gave Roger a personality.
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Offline GrahamRocks!

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Re: KQ8 in retrospect
« Reply #25 on: December 02, 2015, 12:14:33 PM »
I disliked SQ4 for other reasons than just "Roger is a doofus with horrible voice acting" I just honestly hate time travel stories where they either have as the ending "The Hero doesn't remember anything" (there's nothing stopping the bad guys from trying things again with time travel if the hero can't remember anything) or "things are in a loop by the end and things will inevitably happen anyway" (what's the point of doing anything?!) of which it seems that SQ4 is the latter (I thought it was the former too but I'm wrong).

Offline Numbers

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Re: KQ8 in retrospect
« Reply #26 on: December 02, 2015, 01:07:26 PM »
That one stupid puzzle where you're required to take heavy ordinance out of a tank, and then put it right back down where you found it immediately afterward, in order to get maximum points...why? And then having to write down that alien code to get the ship to work, and it's randomized each game...also, running around that conveyor belt area while being chased around by armed goons, leaving it entirely up to chance whether or not you survive = no bueno.
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Offline GrahamRocks!

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Re: KQ8 in retrospect
« Reply #27 on: December 02, 2015, 02:27:35 PM »
And they don't stop for cutscenes, as LPer Dilandau3000 found out, which resulted in one of the funniest moments in the LP for me. ;)

Offline Rock Knight

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Re: KQ8 in retrospect
« Reply #28 on: December 02, 2015, 03:19:03 PM »
You kiddin' me?! SQ5 is my favorite one of the bunch for exactly that reason! I honestly loved that Roger got some actual character growth and development, and you know what that did? It made me LIKE Roger! I'll say it right now, I don't like SQ4 at all and I don't like Roger really in any of the previous games all that much because they either make him an idiot or completely flat with no personality at all. And the latter in an adventure game makes me not really care.

But why does a character in a video game really need to develop? The whole concept of SQ, which set it apart from your typical "macho, in command space guy saves galaxy" was Roger. Roger being your every man, an average joe, even a bit of a doofus, is a big part of what made SQ unique. Here's this idiot savant who is a sucky janitor who somehow bumbles his way to victory. So, your last sentence - I'm guessing you don't care in KQ1? KQ2? KQ3? KQ4? The Royal Family don't really have any personalities per se in those games.

Quote
Yes, a doofus character can be funny. But that's all they are. That doesn't make me root for them. That doesn't make me care. That doesn't make me like them as a character. And while I like SQ6, I really dislike that they act like 5 never freaking happened and just try to uphold the precious, precious "status quo" and strip Roger (literally) of his rank as Captain.

Haven't you ever heard of rooting for the underdog? That's the whole idea of having a doofus protagonist. You root for the little guy. The uncommon hero. 5 sticks out like a sore thumb because it goes against what the entire series was about. It's basically one big parody of Star Trek more than it is an SQ game. It also locked the series into a corner. Now you'd have to have Beatrice in every game and deal with relationship drama when we see that, as late as SQX, Roger's still a single man dating Latex Babes.

Quote
And come on, really? With the reveal of Beatrice in the last game, I just knew they were going to introduce her soon in the next game. It's kinda like the lowly peasant catching the eye of a princess. It's not like it's love at first sight for her, and as for Roger he wants to be with her obviously, but he does have trouble doing it until he saves her life.

Honestly, the fact that they added that Roger wouldn't remember most of SQ4's events left it pretty open. Plus in SQ4, you go to SQ10 and you see Roger is still seemingly single and romancing the Latex Babes, breaking Zondra's heart etc. Which implies he's not married or tied down at that point. She even says Roger told her he "couldn't be tied down. That [he] needed to be free to roam the galaxy."

Introducing Beatrice so quickly like I said, it really locks the series into a box. As does the whole Captain thing.

Offline Rock Knight

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Re: KQ8 in retrospect
« Reply #29 on: December 02, 2015, 03:20:50 PM »
Pretty much what GrahamRocks said. SQ5 gave us some much-needed character development for Roger Wilco, and he finally came into his own, in spite of everything around him. SQ4 and SQ6 were both awful because Roger was completely unlikable in them (not to mention terrible voice acting and puzzles in both). SQ5 actually gave him a chance to prove himself. Consider the SQ fangames that have come out; Vohaul Strikes Back was vastly inferior to Incinerations, because while it did have funny stuff in it, it wasn't the same brand of humor that the main series had, and Roger's idiocy was way over-the-top, to the point that you wonder why Beatrice puts up with him. Incinerations showed Roger finally growing a pair and stepping up to the plate. Who cares if he's not an everyman by that point? There have been plenty of previous games portraying him as a loser, and it's time for him to man up and take on a challenge.

Why was character development needed? I'd argue he came into his own as a nothing, to a nothing who saves the day, in SQ1. I don't see why he's completely unlikeable in SQ4 and SQ6. Yes, he's an idiot, but in SQ4 he proactively saves the day and in SQ6 he risks everything for a friend. That's not the act of someone totally unlikable. Incinerations didn't even feel like an SQ game either. It felt like just another typical sci fi game, with some parodies thrown in.

Offline Numbers

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Re: KQ8 in retrospect
« Reply #30 on: December 02, 2015, 03:56:17 PM »
But why does a character in a video game really need to develop?

...because that's how stories are supposed to play out? Are you listening to yourself right now? Do you have any idea how you sound?
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Offline Rock Knight

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Re: KQ8 in retrospect
« Reply #31 on: December 02, 2015, 04:28:57 PM »
But why does a character in a video game really need to develop?

...because that's how stories are supposed to play out? Are you listening to yourself right now? Do you have any idea how you sound?

We're talking about adventure game characters. Some of the best video game characters don't really have an arc, or a personality (like Sonic and Mario in their original games), and a game based in parody, like Space Quest, shouldn't be about 'character development'. I don't watch comedies for character arcs. I think you're off your meds again, first I'm "prejudiced" because I don't like a sucky gae, and next, not wanting character development in what was a funny, cheesy, 80s/early 90s adventure game series based on comedy is just totally insane.

Offline GrahamRocks!

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Re: KQ8 in retrospect
« Reply #32 on: December 02, 2015, 07:13:13 PM »
*tiredly facepalms* -_-

Eight Deadly Words, RK.

"I Don't Care What Happens To These/This People/Person."

That's why I dislike when there's no character development for someone like Roger.

Bringing this back to KQ for a second... yeah, RK. When it comes to KQ1 and 2, the originals anyway, I don't care. KQ3 at least had a looming threat that you'd want to be as far away from as possible, and KQ4 had people with actual characters to them.

« Last Edit: December 05, 2015, 10:52:34 AM by GrahamRocks! »

Offline Matthew1987

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Re: KQ8 in retrospect
« Reply #33 on: July 27, 2018, 04:36:34 AM »
In retrospect, I think that King's Quest: Mask of Eternity was an amazing game for it's time.

Of course it wasn't able to accomplish what it tried to.  But it pushed the limits of computer systems of the time.

Here is a nice KQ8 parody video:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=a91B3DhnouM

This is the funniest KQ8 video I've ever seen. :)



Soundtrack Dissonance is fun!

Now, pipe organs, those I can understand why they're used in creepy stuff.

Remember Adagio for Strings?

It is played several times in Homeworld.

It usually is played on strings.  Homeworld has a choral version.

I just knew it would be great when played on a pipe organ. :)

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xNQTRzaqXuY
 

anything