Norton Antivirus detects installer as threat

[spinz]

this happened to me with the demo. The way i fixed it is: right click the file, properties, general tab, and then click "unblock" towards the bottom. Then i could delete it.

[wilco64256]

Rest assured, I do understand what you're saying and I have looked over the images that have been provided, etc. but honestly I have no idea what could possibly be causing this issue. It didn't happen to any testers, a number of other backers have reported successful installations and gameplay, and I myself have downloaded and done test installs of every installation package we have out there with no problems at all.

The only thing I can think of at the moment is that Security Essentials stalled for some reason on this particular file, and I'm not entirely sure why that would happen. I'll continue trying to research the issue to see what I can find out, but I am 100% certain it's not the file itself.

[Cez]

Hey guys, we just had a few more people try the file, and I just tried it again myself on 3 different computers and the game installs correctly. Please continue to update us so that we can figure out what the problem is, but it definitely has to do with something in your computer not liking the files, otherwise it would happen on every computer.

But please, give us as much info as possible and we'll continue to work with you until we figure this one out.

Sorry again for the inconvenience.

[spinz]

i just remembered more details of my experience with the demo: initially i couldnt even right click the file. But i could move it, so i moved it onto the desktop, restarted, and then all of a sudden i could right click it.  i couldnt delete it or start it, i was like the other people here and thought it was corrupted on my drive, but i could click properties and select "unblock" and then everything was fine.

[wilco64256]

I just finished attempting to install this on my super old crappy laptop with Windows XP and nowhere near enough video memory or RAM to actually run the game decently, it sat around with the hard drive light having a coronary for about 20 minutes after it finished the download, and then it took another 10 minutes after I double-clicked the file before the installer actually appeared, but it did work on that computer as well. Totally unplayable on that machine, but I was able to download and install that file.

[greenisles]

Ok, I finally have some good news on my end:

After I finished backing up my computer onto an external drive, I removed Microsoft Security Essentials from my computer.  During this process, the computer was still hung up on *something* and was slowly eating my hard drive space.  As soon as the program was uninstalled, my computer *finally* stopped whatever it had been doing, and *some* of my space (~5 gigs) instantly reappeared.

At this point I had control over my computer again (i.e. doing simple tasks like opening my computer or Internet Explorer was no longer causing the system to stop responding).  I immediately dragged the Cognition.exe file into my trash and emptied the bin.  Then I shut down my computer and booted it up again.  

Since then, I have reinstalled Microsoft Security Essentials and ran the updater to patch it to its most current version.  My hard drive (solid state drive actually) is up to 18.8 gigs of free space now.  I don't remember what it was at before this morning so I can't sure that I've gotten everything back, but at least things have stabilized now.

Like inm8#2, I have downloaded several large files in the past (from Gog.com and elsewhere) and MSE has never given any problems like the one I experienced today.  Also I should mention that, like inm8#2, my computer automatically ran chkdsk once during one of my reboots (before I uninstalled MSE).

I wanted to share my experience in case it's helpful for you all.  I'm so glad I didn't have to reinstall my computer, a process that takes at least 1.5 valuable working days of my time.  I DO believe there is a problem with Microsoft Security Essentials AND your file (I don't think it's entirely Microsoft's fault because, like I mentioned, I've never had this problem in the 10+ months I've had this computer w/ MSE installed).

At this point I do not have Cognition installed on my computer, which is a shame because I was really looking forward to playing it for Halloween.  But my computer's health (and my sanity haha) is far more important than any videogame at this point.

[inm8#2]

It seems to be mainly an issue of the finished file being scanned and consolidated onto the HD. This process causes a huge, instantanenous loss of storage space, and the installer file is unmanageable (can't be moved, right-clicked, deleted, etc.).

I'm not sure how something like this could be fixed if the problem can't be replicated on other systems, other than the reported two on which it happened. But from my end the issue occurred when Firefox finished the download and was scanning the file. It may not be the Cognition file at all, but at the same time I don't have this issue with other extremely large downloads.

I'm a patient person and am not of the mindset that I need to play the game as soon as possible at all costs. Obviously I'd love to play Cognition as soon as I can, but my priorities are in trying to recover my lost space and ensure my HDD is healthy. Only then I'll try to download the file again, but to be safe I may try downloading onto another PC then transferring it.

FWIW I was able to download and run the demo with zero complications.

Sorry to put a small damper on your release day, and I hope I don't come off as impatient or upset. I just have a tendency to be as detailed and informative when reporting these kinds of issues to paint as clear a picture as possible. But it sounds like most others are playing and installing the game without issues.

[greenisles]

Hi inm8#2, I just posted above you, please check it out.  Thanks for sharing your experiences btw (although it sucks that this also happened to you, I'm glad someone was there to back me up).

I *think* all of my solid state drive space has returned.  Like I said, I can't be sure.  I was considering wiping everything out and reinstalling Windows again, but at this point it's not worth the time.  Maybe over winter holiday...

Also, I should mention, I had no problems with the Cognition demo.

[wilco64256]

It's totally fine, I completely understand the frustration and would be equally frustrated myself. No doubt part of the issue is that the file isn't digitally signed with some certificate for Microsoft to be happy with it. We did look into doing that but decided to keep all the resources we had focused on actually developing the game.

It might be worth just temporarily turning off the real-time stuff for Security Essentials while downloading and installing the game if you want to give that a try later.

[inm8#2]

greenisles, that's good news. I just saw your post after writing mine. I'm glad you more or less resolved your issue.

Do you mind if you download and run WinDirStat?

http://windirstat.info/

You can compare the used space from WDS to the used space from your drive properties (see my previous posts for the reference). If they match all your space has been recovered. Any difference would be "lost" space.

Also, since you have an SSD you shouldn't run disk defragmenter (but hopefully your SSD has TRIM support).

@ wilco, thanks. Yea I might try that in a couple days or whenever I feel I've resolved my issue. But like greenisles said , the problem seems to boil down to some issue between MSE's certificates and the installer file. Not 100% sure, of course. And I obviously know it's not easy to cover all these potential issues and during the whole process haven't held it against you guys at all. s*** happens.

[greenisles]

I'm wary about installing any additional programs on my machine (especially after today), as this is my work/study computer and I don't want to get into any problems at this point.  In fact, the only non-educational stuff I have installed at the time being are Dosbox and The Quest for Glory Collection.  I used to have the Cognition Demo, but that was uninstalled when I got the release e-mail this morning.

Are you still having problems?  Did you try uninstalling your anti-virus?  Or if it's a built-in antivirus, how about uninstalling Firefox?  Just some suggestions, since uninstalling MSE worked for me.

(Posted on: October 30, 2012, 05:24:48 PM)

Also, thanks for the tip regarding disk defragment.  I've known for a while that it's not meant for SSDs, but it was kind of you to mention it just in case.

(Posted on: October 30, 2012, 05:27:26 PM)

Ok, I downloaded the program you suggested.  Unforunately I seem to be missing space as well

Right clicking on my C: drive shows 107 gigs as being used, but WinStat says only 101.4 is used.

Wow.  Have I lost this space permanently?  I think I may try reinstalling my computer now, which is 1.5 days of my life down the drain...

[inm8#2]

edit - and just saw your update.

That's what I feared - you have missing space, too. Mine is 6.8 GB, yours appears to be 5.6 GB.

I'm not sure how to recover it. Will be seeking help on tech support forums when I can later today. I wasn't really convinced that uninstalling MSE would do the trick.

During the whole process, I'm not sure what happened, but Windows thinks that space is still being used. During the system hangup maybe the OS was dumping temporary files somewhere and lost track of them. I'm not sure.

If you right click on "Computer" in the Start Menu, select "Manage", then check your Disk Management, it should show the total drive capacity. Mine is as it should be. The system just thinks 6.8 GB are being used when they aren't.

[greenisles]

Yeah, my total drive capacity is correctly shown as well, but the amount used does not match up with the number calculated by WinDirStat.  

I thought you were still experiencing the hard drive constantly being used/drive being eaten problem, which is why I recommended uninstalling the antivirus.  I guess we're both in the same situation now (i.e. computer stable, but drive with mysteriously lost space)?  Please let me know if you find a solution to this.  A complete format and reinstall *should* fix the problem, right?

To Phoenix Online: I think you may want to look into this problem further, or at least post some sort of disclaimer so that future customers don't experience the same fate as we two did.  I think telling people to disable their antivirus BEFORE downloading the file could be extremely helpful.

(Posted on: October 30, 2012, 10:07:47 PM)

Ok, so I formatted my drive and reinstalled my computer (that's the easy part - the hard part is getting all my files and programs up and running).

I also installed WinDirStat (WDS) again, but this time I'm having the opposite problem:

Total capacity on C: drive (WDS): 121.8 gigs
Total capacity on C: drive (Windows properties): 119

Size used on C: drive (WDS): 17.8
Size used on C: drive (Windows properties): 14.9

Free space on C: drive (WDS): 104
Free space on C: drive (Windows properties): 104

So basically the free space on my drive matches up, but the total capacity and space used don't.  I'm thinking these are just manufacturer files that WDS is picking up that Windows doesn't use in its own calculations?  Or do you think I permanently lost some space with this morning's situation?

(Posted on: October 30, 2012, 11:44:33 PM)

Also note: the numbers from Windows properties add up correctly (14.9 + 104 = 119) and ditto for the WDS numbers (17.8 + 104 = 121.8 ).  

I just don't understand where the 17.8 (and consequently, 121.8 ) are coming from.

I can't remember if my SSD capacity is 119 or 121.8.  I wish I did, as this would help answer all my questions...

[inm8#2]

If your free space is in agreement, I think you're okay. Maybe WDS is picking up on some hidden files since it definitely scans for everything. I'm not sure, though. If you have recovery partitions maybe WDS is reading that also.

I don't know your situation exactly, but I *think* you should be fine. I really, really want to avoid formatting my HD and reinstalling everything. I am currently running a HD diagnostic test per advice from another forum. I'll keep you updated probably through PM since we're getting OT here.

The major question is if you'll give the download another try! If I fix everything I will try downloading to USB through another PC then installing. But that's some days away, I fear.

[Cez]

Hope your guys computers are fine. Really, really sorry for what's happened, and I hope that you guys can enjoy the game very soon!!

Keep us posted, I'm keeping an eye on this thread.

[GrandDevil]

Hi,

I've have the exact same problem when using the kickstarter download and have tried it on two different PC's.

Both of them stalls when after trying to download the file, like it never finishes the download and it's not possible to right click the file.

Both times I've been able to get rid of the executable stressing the system by using "moveonboot".

But I just can't install the game and that's sad after backing the project and really looking forward to it.

Could you perhaps zip the file or divide the installation into smaller files.

[wilco64256]

The file is actually already compressed, it's just best to disable any antivirus or Security Essentials before even starting the download so they can't panic and take over at all.

[inm8#2]

I've run two extended diagnostic tests on my hard drive. Both tests have run slowly, stalled, and eventually failed due to many bad sectors.

With a third report of the same issue, I don't think it's an isolated problem.

[wilco64256]

I've run two extended diagnostic tests on my hard drive. Both tests have run slowly, stalled, and eventually failed due to many bad sectors.

With a third report of the same issue, I don't think it's an isolated problem.

While I agree that a number of people may be likely to encounter the same issue, I don't think there's anything that we can do about it from our end. It'd take a significant amount of time for us to get the proper certificates coordinated through Microsoft, and a pretty solid chunk of change out of our already stretched-super-thin budget.

The recommendation I always give in general is to shut off antivirus software anytime somebody is downloading a product from a trusted source. And never to turn off a system during a memory dump or virus scan.

[snabbott]

Actually, signatures on large files can cause issues, too, since the entire file has to be processed in order to determine if the key is valid. I came across this with UAC on Windows 7 a while back - it took a few minutes before it even prompted me about allowing the installer to run.