Poll

Should King's Quest stay dead?

Yes--It's had its time
4 (21.1%)
No--more entries can be made
15 (78.9%)

Total Members Voted: 18

Author Topic: Poll: Should KQ stay dead?  (Read 30288 times)

Offline Neonivek

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Re: Poll: Should KQ stay dead?
« Reply #60 on: March 03, 2013, 01:46:47 PM »
Ok here is the major difference between Kings Quest 5 and 7 with the assumption that they are both bad games.

-Kings Quest 5 is a good game bogged down by really annoying aspects.
-Kings Quest 7 is just not a very good game bogged down by being slow.

Honestly to me KQ6 is just the 5th game done right. The problems with KQ7 cannot be "Fixed" because it isn't broken.
« Last Edit: March 03, 2013, 01:48:31 PM by Neonivek »

Offline Bludshot

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Re: Poll: Should KQ stay dead?
« Reply #61 on: March 03, 2013, 03:28:39 PM »
I don't think a game can be bogged down when the really annoying aspects are representative of the games entire design.
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Offline Lambonius

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Re: Poll: Should KQ stay dead?
« Reply #62 on: March 03, 2013, 03:45:33 PM »
I don't think a game can be bogged down when the really annoying aspects are representative of the games entire design.

KQ5 or 7?

Offline Bludshot

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Re: Poll: Should KQ stay dead?
« Reply #63 on: March 03, 2013, 05:29:42 PM »
Both.
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Offline Lambonius

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Re: Poll: Should KQ stay dead?
« Reply #64 on: March 03, 2013, 05:51:36 PM »
I think with stronger voice acting and some alternate puzzle solutions which would eliminate dead-ends, KQ5 would be pretty much perfect.  It has a classic fairy tale story, memorable characters, amazing art direction and music, and some great puzzles.  I don't see how those other aspects are indicative of a fundamentally flawed experience that is beyond salvage.

KQ7, on the other hand, IS a much more fundamentally flawed game from an all-encompassing design standpoint.  The decision to break the game into chapters, the over-simplified and visually intrusive interface, the poor art direction, the bad animation, a bland story with an unsatisfying resolution, etc--in addition to bad voice acting, awkward characterization of familiar characters, and annoying new characters, among other things.  There are significantly more fundamental gameplay and design problems there.
« Last Edit: March 03, 2013, 05:54:50 PM by Lambonius »

Offline Bludshot

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Re: Poll: Should KQ stay dead?
« Reply #65 on: March 03, 2013, 06:04:45 PM »
I certainly don't contest that the game looks and sounds great, but everything else just doesn't work for me.  The characters that are most memorable to me are memorable for unintentional hilarity and there are just so many dead ends and the most bizarre puzzle solutions in the genre until Gabriel Knight 3 took the title.

Everything is trial and error in that game, but not of any sensible variety, you try all your items on the yeti until you get to the pie, all your items on the snake until you get to the tambourine, and the wedge of cheese, that damn cheese, if you are lucky enough to even have it, why would you ever use it on that wand transfer thingy unless you were just trying every item you had on it out of desperation?

Could it have been done better? Sure, KQ6 is pretty indicative of that, but I don't see it as a matter of fixing a handful of things, I think a "good" KQ5 would be pretty unrecognizable to the actual game.

At least its horribleness is charming, it's like Tommy Wiseau's 'The Room,' it's bad but at least you can have a decent time while you're playing it.
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Offline KatieHal

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Re: Poll: Should KQ stay dead?
« Reply #66 on: March 03, 2013, 08:19:19 PM »
Hm...thing is, I don't think KQ7 is unsalvageable either. Not that I'm about to take that project on personally, but in terms of 'Can we brainstorm ways to make it better that don't utterly change the game?'

So, for example, the chapter-based story. I don't think this is horrible, but it's not done very well. So let's be specific, how do you think the game could be made better while still keeping the two protagonists as playable characters? 'You' being a question to anyone who feels like answering, that is.


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Offline Lambonius

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Re: Poll: Should KQ stay dead?
« Reply #67 on: March 03, 2013, 08:24:49 PM »
Well, I just don't think the intercutting is handled very well in the game.  The cliffhangers feel forced to me, and don't really build any real tension--you know you'll be getting back to that character eventually, and that they aren't going to die unless you make them die.  I'd have preferred an approach more in the vein of the Lord of the Rings books--where each story is told to completion, and then they come together in the end.

Offline Neonivek

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Re: Poll: Should KQ stay dead?
« Reply #68 on: March 04, 2013, 01:03:12 PM »
Well to me it is the tweeking required.

Kings Quest 7 needs an overhaul while KQ5 needs a few changes.

I disagree that a fixed KQ5 would be unrecognisable, in fact it would probably be rather similar and likely involve a VERY much less annoying Cedric.

Quote
So, for example, the chapter-based story. I don't think this is horrible, but it's not done very well. So let's be specific, how do you think the game could be made better while still keeping the two protagonists as playable characters? 'You' being a question to anyone who feels like answering, that is

Honestly in many ways it is just lost potential.

The way it is done in the game is it allows them to have a "Personal antagonistic gameplay" With Rosella being constantly on the run. While at the same time having Valanice fixing things.

Never do these stories interfere with eachother or really affect anything and thus often feel more like two entirely different stories. Wouldn't it be interesting if one change Rosella needed to do to get out of a situation dooms Valanice later in the story or if one had to save the other?

When I think of games where you had to play seperate characters who weren't on the same screen it was always about what unique problem solving or ability they brought to the table and how everything came together as one story.

Offline Numbers

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Re: Poll: Should KQ stay dead?
« Reply #69 on: March 05, 2013, 02:24:43 PM »
At least its horribleness is charming, it's like Tommy Wiseau's 'The Room,' it's bad but at least you can have a decent time while you're playing it.

You are TEARING ME APART, Cedric!
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Offline stika

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Re: Poll: Should KQ stay dead?
« Reply #70 on: March 05, 2013, 02:36:12 PM »
OH HAI MARK!

Offline Bludshot

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Re: Poll: Should KQ stay dead?
« Reply #71 on: March 05, 2013, 07:00:30 PM »
At least its horribleness is charming, it's like Tommy Wiseau's 'The Room,' it's bad but at least you can have a decent time while you're playing it.

You are TEARING ME APART, Cedric!

Well Graham and Cedric do have a dysfunctional relationship.
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Offline stika

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Re: Poll: Should KQ stay dead?
« Reply #72 on: March 06, 2013, 02:46:50 AM »
At least its horribleness is charming, it's like Tommy Wiseau's 'The Room,' it's bad but at least you can have a decent time while you're playing it.

You are TEARING ME APART, Cedric!

Well Graham and Cedric do have a dysfunctional relationship.
You are a LION I NEVAR hit you! Cedric!

Offline snabbott

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Re: Poll: Should KQ stay dead?
« Reply #73 on: March 06, 2013, 07:15:18 AM »
YouTube wants me to watch this: :P
<a href="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=v-t15XPRJvM" target="_blank">http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=v-t15XPRJvM</a>

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Offline Neonivek

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Re: Poll: Should KQ stay dead?
« Reply #74 on: March 06, 2013, 07:19:03 AM »
The only reason I havn't watched their kings quest series yet is because I havn't fully beat 5 or 6.

Offline Blackthorne

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Re: Poll: Should KQ stay dead?
« Reply #75 on: March 06, 2013, 03:07:22 PM »
Honestly, Cedric would be much less annoying if voiced by someone else.  The poor "actor" who did it originally just didn't give him the kind of character and charm he needed.

The game could use a bunch of minor fixes, but it wouldn't need a total overhaul like KQ7 would.  That game is a living, breathing disaster.


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Offline Bludshot

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Re: Poll: Should KQ stay dead?
« Reply #76 on: March 06, 2013, 06:39:31 PM »
The only reason I havn't watched their kings quest series yet is because I havn't fully beat 5 or 6.

As a big fan of 6, I will confess the climax is pretty meh, the best the game has to offer is already behind you at that point, but the ending does it's job.

Completing 5 will just give you more pain, the puzzles reach peak stupid in Mordack's castle, they will harm you.
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Offline Numbers

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Re: Poll: Should KQ stay dead?
« Reply #77 on: March 06, 2013, 06:59:35 PM »
Just remember: bunnies > dragons.
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Offline Neonivek

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Re: Poll: Should KQ stay dead?
« Reply #78 on: March 06, 2013, 07:13:39 PM »
Honestly, Cedric would be much less annoying if voiced by someone else.  The poor "actor" who did it originally just didn't give him the kind of character and charm he needed.
Bt

Honestly Cedric can stick to being exactly as annoying as before. He just needs to not be in as much.

I mean listen to how people talk about Cedric from KQ5 as if he was their dorky best friend. Sure he is annoying but that had a certain charm. It just didn't hit that balance.

Offline stika

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Re: Poll: Should KQ stay dead?
« Reply #79 on: March 07, 2013, 12:26:47 PM »
Just remember: bunnies > dragons.
especially if it's a vorpal bunny (Wizardry reference)
 

anything