Author Topic: Should KQ games have a day/night cycle?  (Read 4310 times)

Sir Perceval of Daventry

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Should KQ games have a day/night cycle?
« on: February 27, 2013, 10:28:20 AM »
In almost every KQ game--with the exception of KQ4--it is perpetually day time. You can have the player character stand there for hours and it will still be the same time. I always thought this to be a flaw in the series. While I don't think that a day/night cycle should be timed out--like, have to do with puzzles or events (ala QFG), I do think just having the day slowly transition from morning to afternoon to night, and perhaps adding in an element like a KQ character having to find a place to sleep or something during the night, might add a more modern touch to the games. You could even have it be slightly like KQ4 in that certain things or certain characters can only be met at night or something. I just think it'd be a nice touch.

Offline Bludshot

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Re: Should KQ games have a day/night cycle?
« Reply #1 on: February 27, 2013, 06:07:23 PM »
Don't see why they should've. 

EDIT: Should've read your post more closely my mistake.  I think trying to add a sense of realism to KQ is unnecessary, in QFG it is part of the RPG half of the game, but I think in KQ it would just get tedious.
« Last Edit: February 27, 2013, 06:20:32 PM by Bludshot »
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Offline Jafar

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Re: Should KQ games have a day/night cycle?
« Reply #2 on: February 28, 2013, 01:45:25 AM »
Throwing in a day\night cycle with no point would be...well...pointless. :P
The QFG games were designed with the clock in mind. Some puzzles can only be solved at certain times of day, your character gets exhausted and needs to rest and sleep, etc.

But throwing in a day\night cycle just because it's "more realistic"...meh. I wouldn't want a day\night system if all it did was interuppt me with "Oops, it's nighttime, you have to stop your adventuring and sleep till it's morning". It'd also just end up raising questions like "If all these days are passing, how come I'm not getting older\starving\the villain hasn't carried out his evil plan yet?" :P

Features like that shouldn't be thrown in for no reason. I'd only want a day\night cycle if it was worked into the game, not tossed in for flair.
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Offline KatieHal

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Re: Should KQ games have a day/night cycle?
« Reply #3 on: February 28, 2013, 07:36:55 AM »
Yeah--only if it adds to the game itself. Otherwise, adding one just for the heck of it, is a LOT of work for the developers. You need to make two versions of every screen that you might come across in either the day or night setting. That basically means you're cutting down on how many brand new and unique scenes you can create for the game. And since part of KQ is about exploration, you really want that chance for new & unique screens there too.

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Offline Neonivek

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Re: Should KQ games have a day/night cycle?
« Reply #4 on: February 28, 2013, 10:16:20 AM »
A lot of the Kings Quest games take place over a single day and occur in real time.

In fact that majority of them do. A Day and Night Cycle would be odd.

Offline Bludshot

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Re: Should KQ games have a day/night cycle?
« Reply #5 on: February 28, 2013, 10:39:04 AM »
Neonivek where did you get that idea? Time has always been incredibly vague in the series with the excpetion of KQ4.

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Offline Neonivek

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Re: Should KQ games have a day/night cycle?
« Reply #6 on: February 28, 2013, 10:51:39 AM »
Neonivek where did you get that idea? Time has always been incredibly vague in the series with the excpetion of KQ4.

KQ6 and 7 outright tells you how much time you had left outright.

While indeed time was vague you outright knew that you didn't have days or weeks to solve your own problems.

The rest can just be assumed to happen in real time.

Offline Bludshot

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Re: Should KQ games have a day/night cycle?
« Reply #7 on: February 28, 2013, 02:22:25 PM »
Don't know how you are supposed to assume real time.

What are you referring to in KQs 6&7, I only recall vague "time is of the essence!" lines.
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Offline Matthew1987

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Re: Should KQ games have a day/night cycle?
« Reply #8 on: December 16, 2013, 08:07:20 PM »
Quote from: KatieHal
adding one just for the heck of it, is a LOT of work for the developers. You need to make two versions of every screen that you might come across in either the day or night setting.

Not true.

If it's realtime 3D rendered (which The Silver Lining is, although it doesn't have free movement), all you have to do is change the lighting.  It's as easy as changing a few numbers (although you may want to change some things in the game world as well).

You can even do that with a 2D game.  But most of today's games are 3D anyway.

realMYST is in realtime 3D with free movement, and has changing time of day and changing weather effects, unlike the original version of MYST.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nF_q4OsEvuU

Offline KatieHal

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Re: Should KQ games have a day/night cycle?
« Reply #9 on: December 16, 2013, 09:06:44 PM »
I don't know the fine details of doing it--not my expertise--but I know we recently did a day & night version of a scene and it was more complicated than that. It largely would depend on what your art style is, actually--some screens will be more work than others depending on that.

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Offline Thaumaturge

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Re: Should KQ games have a day/night cycle?
« Reply #10 on: December 22, 2013, 07:22:23 AM »
As you say, Katie, I think that the amount of work involved would likely depend heavily on your art style.

In a relatively straightforward realtime-3D art style I could see it being fairly simple, perhaps involving a pair of directional lights (one each of the sun and moon) that change their positions and intensities, along with a good shadow system. Presuming that the shadows were already implemented for more general use I could see a day-night cycle not being a major addition in terms of art.

For some 2D art styles a shader might be conceived to handle the effect: no change in daylight, shifting to a desaturated blue to represent night, perhaps. Look at the lighting used in CANDLE, for example.

The above is off of the top of my head, however, and may well be missing some complexity.

Other art styles, however, might well call for rather more work, especially if you want significant changes for the various times of day (silver sparkling in the moonlight, or fireflies that come out at night, for example).

I would also like to note if the day-night cycle were to have an impact on gameplay -- such as the player being required to find a place to sleep -- then that would likely call for work in balancing those changes, making sure that the cycle is long enough that the repetition doesn't become tiresome but short enough that it actually does impact the game, making sure that it doesn't adversely affect puzzle-solving (perhaps by interrupting puzzles), etc.

Perhaps a middle ground might be found (in a hypothetical new King's Quest, at least) in having a day-night cycle that progresses as the game progresses, with the game being designed for only limited returning to previous areas, allowing the day-night cycle to be incorporated into the art of a given screen.

As to the original question of whether it might work in King's Quest, I think that I'm going to go with those who said that it depends on whether it adds to the game. For myself, I don't think that it would add to most of them, although I could see it reinforcing the idea of having a limited amount of time in which to work in King's Quest 3. I could see it adding to some new game (as I mentioned above), however.

Offline Neonivek

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Re: Should KQ games have a day/night cycle?
« Reply #11 on: December 23, 2013, 04:36:34 PM »
Don't know how you are supposed to assume real time.

What are you referring to in KQs 6&7, I only recall vague "time is of the essence!" lines.

For both KQ6 and 7 they specifically tell you how much time you have.

You have a single day for KQ6 (The time until the wedding) and a afternoon for 7 (The time until the Volcano).

As for "It would be easy to add in night with that program" I mean yeah it would be really easy to make the scene dark... but to make the scene well lit for both day and night shots is where the challenge would be.