Author Topic: Moebius 2.0 has broken Vsync - please fix  (Read 11022 times)

Offline MarkoH01

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Moebius 2.0 has broken Vsync - please fix
« on: December 16, 2015, 03:43:30 AM »
I have already said this in the update thread but since nobody ansered yet and I think this issue is too important I made an extra thread for it.

The new Moebius version (2.0) has much better anti aliasing and works great. However vsync is not working anymore which you can clearly see if you watch the opening cut scene - there is screen tearing clearly visible. I tried the GOG version of the game and after seeing this I reinstalled my backuped older Moebius version and there vsync works. Please fix this because I cannot enjoy great cut scenes if they have screen tearing. I have also tried to force vsync and it did not work. (Win7/64 - GTX960).

Offline Oldbushie

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Re: Moebius 2.0 has broken Vsync - please fix
« Reply #1 on: December 17, 2015, 10:39:57 AM »
I'm sorry to hear that you're having issues. We are currently working on an update for GK and Moebius which we hope to have out in January. These will be using newer versions of Unity and the video plugin, which should help. I know the code forces VSync to be on due to walking calculations, so it is there...
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Offline MarkoH01

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Re: Moebius 2.0 has broken Vsync - please fix
« Reply #2 on: December 19, 2015, 04:10:53 AM »
I'm sorry to hear that you're having issues. We are currently working on an update for GK and Moebius which we hope to have out in January. These will be using newer versions of Unity and the video plugin, which should help. I know the code forces VSync to be on due to walking calculations, so it is there...

Thank you for the quick answer. If you want to test if vsync is working correctly all you have to do is watch the first seconds of the opening credits (light and camera movement) you can clearly see the screen tearing. I always force vsync to be on because I cannot stand screen tearing at all. As I said it worked fine on the old engine (but oin the old engine AA was much worse). Maybe it is not forced during cut scenes but in the game? Anyway I am really looking forward to the (hopefully) january update and I am confident that you will be able to fix the issues. Please don't forget to update the GOG version (in my experience some devs like to update steam but seem to "forget" GOG, humble ect. ;)).

May I post another question here since I have your attention?
At the moment I am playing Cognition GOTY with German subtitles and I noticed that there are some translations which are still missing and some very few were there is the wrong subtitle shown. I have no problem to note those things (Even telling you which German subtitles SHOULD be displayed and maybe including screenshots) but I don't know since Cognition is quite old if it even still is supported. I don't want to get into this kind of work if it would lead to nothing. So the question is: would you like to have such notes to have the possibility to fix these few localisation bugs?

Offline Oldbushie

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Re: Moebius 2.0 has broken Vsync - please fix
« Reply #3 on: December 19, 2015, 08:41:06 AM »
Alright, I'll give that a test on our current version to see if it's still an issue. We do try to be consistent with releasing patches to other sites as well, but it's difficult as we have a lot of distributors. We usually take care of GOG alongside Steam and standalone, so I'm surprised that one got missed until now.

We are definitely still doing some work on Cognition to get it ready for mobile, so that may be one of the issues we're re-examining. I've sent you a PM with more info on who to contact.
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Offline MarkoH01

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Re: Moebius 2.0 has broken Vsync - please fix
« Reply #4 on: April 09, 2016, 05:59:46 AM »
I'm sorry to hear that you're having issues. We are currently working on an update for GK and Moebius which we hope to have out in January. These will be using newer versions of Unity and the video plugin, which should help. I know the code forces VSync to be on due to walking calculations, so it is there...

Any news about this patch? It should be released in january and now we have april.

Offline Oldbushie

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Re: Moebius 2.0 has broken Vsync - please fix
« Reply #5 on: April 09, 2016, 09:02:53 AM »
Sorry about that! We had a busy few months but we finally have a chunk of time next week we can devote to finishing up the Moebius patch. We've already addressed most of the urgent issues, so we're wrapping up polish and then we can push it out.
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Offline MarkoH01

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Re: Moebius 2.0 has broken Vsync - please fix
« Reply #6 on: April 27, 2016, 05:25:09 PM »
Sorry about that! We had a busy few months but we finally have a chunk of time next week we can devote to finishing up the Moebius patch. We've already addressed most of the urgent issues, so we're wrapping up polish and then we can push it out.

Thank you very much for your reply. I am looking forward to it.

One thing I noticed regarding vsync in general: vsync does seem to behave quite different on Win7 wether you have turned windows aero on or off. With aero on vsync problems are often not noticable. The problem is that I don't like aero therefore I have tuned it off constantly. But this might help in future testing of games treating vsync issues so you may figure out why some users report issues and some don't. It should be an additional QA step to try the game with aero turned off.

Offline MarkoH01

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Re: Moebius 2.0 has broken Vsync - please fix
« Reply #7 on: May 17, 2016, 03:27:02 AM »
Hi Oldbushie,
yesterday GOG uploaded the newest Moebius release. I tested it and unfortunately the tearing issues still are there. The only way to get rid of them is to turn aero on (which is turned off permanently because I don't like it). I still wonder why those tearing issues were completely absent (no matter if aero was turned on or off) in the Unity3 version of the game? Could it be that the new Unity engine was downgraded so that it only provides proper vsync handling when aero is turned on?

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Re: Moebius 2.0 has broken Vsync - please fix
« Reply #8 on: May 17, 2016, 08:54:56 AM »
I have no idea. This is not something I experience on my own machine (Windows 7 with Aero off). We are using the latest version of Unity 4 for this release, but we are migrating to Unity 5 the next time we patch it. Due to the number of fixes that were required for the Linux release we didn't want to risk the jump to Unity 5 just yet. We do not have any control over how Unity handles VSync.
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Offline MarkoH01

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Re: Moebius 2.0 has broken Vsync - please fix
« Reply #9 on: May 17, 2016, 01:15:21 PM »
I have no idea. This is not something I experience on my own machine (Windows 7 with Aero off). We are using the latest version of Unity 4 for this release, but we are migrating to Unity 5 the next time we patch it. Due to the number of fixes that were required for the Linux release we didn't want to risk the jump to Unity 5 just yet. We do not have any control over how Unity handles VSync.

That is interesting. So it IS possible to eliminate tearing (especially in the cutscenes) without turning aero on. So it seems to be a hardware issue. But thank you for telling me.

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Re: Moebius 2.0 has broken Vsync - please fix
« Reply #10 on: May 17, 2016, 01:16:34 PM »
You're welcome! Hopefully you're able to find a solution. I have an Nvidia 980 GTX, so that could be part of it. Have you tried different quality levels?
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Offline MarkoH01

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Re: Moebius 2.0 has broken Vsync - please fix
« Reply #11 on: May 19, 2016, 02:10:00 PM »
You're welcome! Hopefully you're able to find a solution. I have an Nvidia 980 GTX, so that could be part of it. Have you tried different quality levels?

GTX960 here - so not that much different.
It is getting better on lower quality ("fastest" was it, I think?)
It is really strange. In most of the games I have vsync works without any problem whenever I have turned it on in game or forced it via control panel. So far only these games won't work (only possibility turning aero on):

Moebius 2.0 +
Firewatch
MIND: Path to Thalamus (works after I press twice ALT+ENTER to switch from fullscreen to window then back to fullscreen)
Pony Island (does not have vsync option at all but forcing does not work either)

MIND is a Unreal 4 game and all others are Unity. I am quite sure that the creators of MIND just implemented borderless window instead of real fullscreen so switching to real fullscreen activates the vsync (which never did work for me in a window). The creators of Firewatch already confirmed that their fullscreen is borderless window but switching does not help - same with Pony Island and now Moebius. It must have something to do with the newer Unity engines (original Moebius and Cognition worked great) AND my GPU.

I always see people in "Let's Plays" turning off vsync and I never understood this. I really hate tearing, the game feels broken for me when the screen tears. Luckily with aero I have a workaround - now I am trying to turn on aero without seeing that it is turned on which of course is a bit paradox. :)

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Re: Moebius 2.0 has broken Vsync - please fix
« Reply #12 on: May 19, 2016, 02:57:57 PM »
I'm glad you found a workaround! For what it's worth, we have VSync enabled on all quality levels, so for it to not work at all for you (outside of aero mode) is very strange. The only special thing we have done is disable DirectX 11 on our older games, because our shaders don't play nice with it.
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Offline snabbott

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Re: Moebius 2.0 has broken Vsync - please fix
« Reply #13 on: May 20, 2016, 01:38:45 PM »

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Offline MarkoH01

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Re: Moebius 2.0 has broken Vsync - please fix
« Reply #14 on: May 20, 2016, 03:12:18 PM »
I'm glad you found a workaround! For what it's worth, we have VSync enabled on all quality levels, so for it to not work at all for you (outside of aero mode) is very strange. The only special thing we have done is disable DirectX 11 on our older games, because our shaders don't play nice with it.

Maybe I should add that I stopped playing after the tearing started in the first cutscene. So maybe it is not the game itself but the way the cutscene is rendered or played?

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Re: Moebius 2.0 has broken Vsync - please fix
« Reply #15 on: May 20, 2016, 06:54:59 PM »
It's possible. We're using a special plugin that helps the videos play in mobile mode as well (across all our games) so maybe it's not playing nice in your setup. You could try playing the videos directly from StreamingAssets and see if that tearing still happens.
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Offline MarkoH01

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Re: Moebius 2.0 has broken Vsync - please fix
« Reply #16 on: May 21, 2016, 09:15:29 AM »
It's possible. We're using a special plugin that helps the videos play in mobile mode as well (across all our games) so maybe it's not playing nice in your setup. You could try playing the videos directly from StreamingAssets and see if that tearing still happens.

Unfortunately it seems to be the game. I renamed the into cutscene file in StreamingAssets and it did play correctly in bsplayer (although without any sound). I also tested the game itself a bit and noticed those tearing effects whenever there was a fade out or fade in to the map.

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Re: Moebius 2.0 has broken Vsync - please fix
« Reply #17 on: June 10, 2016, 12:23:17 PM »
I meanwhilce bought GK and it is the same. Unity 4 no tearing Unity 5 tearing. It really seems to be the engine here. I am just downloading the newest nvidia drivers in the hope that nvidia may have fixed this.

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Re: Moebius 2.0 has broken Vsync - please fix
« Reply #18 on: June 10, 2016, 12:40:33 PM »
Moebius is still on Unity 4, so it's not a Unity 5 specific thing. We did fix GK at least to use the native video plugin for desktop, so I'm surprised cutscenes would still be tearing on the latest update (2.01) for you.
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Re: Moebius 2.0 has broken Vsync - please fix
« Reply #19 on: June 17, 2016, 03:00:45 PM »
Moebius is still on Unity 4, so it's not a Unity 5 specific thing. We did fix GK at least to use the native video plugin for desktop, so I'm surprised cutscenes would still be tearing on the latest update (2.01) for you.

All I know is thet the problem never occured on Cognition and on the oebius release prior 2.0. So if Moebius 2.0 was Unity 4 and it wasn't before it seems that all Unity versions greater 3 are problematic for me which means many, many games. I intent to write directly to the Unity devs and ask them if they would have an explanation or better even a fix. All other games don't have a problem no matter if aero is on or off - only those specifoc Unity games. There HAS to be an explanation and I really want to find out what this explanation is.

Since GK still does have the issue even with the video plugin replaced it's quite clear that this was not the source of the problem. It would have surprised me if it were because as I said other newer Unity games produce the same problem for me.
« Last Edit: June 17, 2016, 03:03:53 PM by MarkoH01 »