"The Father" and other questions...

Novaman5000 · January 18, 2006, 06:47:01 PM

I don't know how the fan community reacted to the "tinkering" with the plotline that KQII+ did, but I recently completed it and found it very interesting. I know the team has stated that they're not following the alternate senarios set in this game, but what do you think the chances that we'll see a father-like character in the new series?

For those who haven't played it, the new version introduces "The Father" as a shadowy figure who is behind not only the events in KQ2+ but eventually will be the cause of all that befalls the characters for the rest of the series (or at least up until the 4th game). KQ2 establishes his connection to most of the villains for the next 3 games. There's a sequence where King Graham, looking out over the ravaged Daventry in KQ3, is approached by the Father, who gives him the option of saving the people of his world, of stopping all the terrible things plaguing Daventry, if he would only surrender the kingdom to him. It's short, but I thought it was a great moment. I thought the father was a really neat way of tying things together and making an uber-villain. What I liked the most was how they only hinted at his ultimate goal: He was searching for something incredibly powerful in the land of Daventry that was hidden from even the King. They hinted that this thing was something really epic.

Creating a character that has been the main cause of everything that's happened would be an awesome twist as well as a way to provide finality to the series one he/she is dead. Sort of like...You stop the person who has been behind it all and you can live happily ever after. It make the game even more of an epic than if it was simply a new villain that no one is invested in because everything (game, storyline) has led up to this final confrontation. Plus, it would make for a character that's so easy to hate and so completely evil that it would probably end up being the greatest KQ villain of all time.

I found it kind of interesting because the creators of KQIX were very against Mask of Eternity because it stood alone in terms of it's connections to other games, and had many loose ends yet they decided against going with the alternate timeline in KQ2, which, while unofficial, does a much better of tying everything together than the original KQ2 did (at least in my opinion). Any idea why?

So what do you guys think? Those of you who played the new version... did you like the character of the father? Do you think that the villain of the new games will be someone who is tied to the series (as the father supposedly was or as Mannan was to Mordack)? or will it be an all new villain, with the main characters being the only real connection to the series?

Yonkey · January 19, 2006, 12:41:09 PM

Quote from: Novaman5000 on January 18, 2006, 06:47:01 PM
I found it kind of interesting because the creators of KQIX were very against Mask of Eternity because it stood alone in terms of it's connections to other games, and had many loose ends yet they decided against going with the alternate timeline in KQ2, which, while unofficial, does a much better of tying everything together than the original KQ2 did (at least in my opinion). Any idea why?

The reason is because the "Father" storyline clashes with ours too much, sine they were developed independently of each other. The main villain in our game is Shadrack, who is actually both a new and old character. He was mentioned in previous games and is known to have a connection with the Black Cloak Society, but beyond that, there is very little known about him. This allows us to completely develop his character history, personality & storyline.

It was nice that AGDI gave KQ2 more of a storyline, but by creating the Father, they opened another plot hole. It's up to them to close it, not us.

You can find out more information about this topic here.

Deloria · January 28, 2006, 03:50:22 AM

Quote from: Novaman5000 on January 18, 2006, 06:47:01 PM
Creating a character that has been the main cause of everything that's happened would be an awesome twist as well as a way to provide finality to the series one he/she is dead. Sort of like...You stop the person who has been behind it all and you can live happily ever after. It make the game even more of an epic than if it was simply a new villain that no one is invested in because everything (game, storyline) has led up to this final confrontation. Plus, it would make for a character that's so easy to hate and so completely evil that it would probably end up being the greatest KQ villain of all time.

I found it kind of interesting because the creators of KQIX were very against Mask of Eternity because it stood alone in terms of it's connections to other games, and had many loose ends yet they decided against going with the alternate timeline in KQ2, which, while unofficial, does a much better of tying everything together than the original KQ2 did (at least in my opinion). Any idea why?

Well, suppose another fan-company decided to make a KQX and added that the father like character had a brother who was ready to avenge him? it just keeps going on and on. Sierra could have stopped with KQ3, but they decided to make a game with Rosella and after that, figured "Wouldn't it be neat if Manannan had a brotehr?" then they added him and lo and behold it's a repeat of what you just said.

Novaman5000 · January 28, 2006, 09:55:03 AM

That's true, but what I liked about the Father character to begin with was the fact that he wasn't just related or connected to people in each game, he was BEHIND everything that happened... The ultimate villain. I have to say I'm intrigued by the the way the development team is going in terms of villains, though. Father or not, I'm really excited for this game.

Rosedragon · February 14, 2006, 12:05:05 PM

Welcome, Novaman. How long have you been posting here? I too loved AGDI's KQ2+, thought it was an awesome game. I have my own version of KQ2, with my story about Morena, The Secret Heroine of Daventry, I have changed the name to Morena's Tale. I love the AGDI's story for KQ2+. Thought the vampires and werewolves were cool. The Father is pretty cool, very interesting character, I like his way of fooling Graham until the end, his sly cold plots and the way he manages to escape with magic and reveal his true power to Graham. His name, calling himself "the Father" is creepy, when I think of names like the Father I think of God, how the Bible says he is our Father, I usually think of good qualities connected to fathers. It is a new idea to me, of an evil father. I agree he is the ultimate villain.

Cez · February 16, 2006, 04:34:30 PM

yeah, in our game, he's called Shadrack

awesomeasapossum · February 16, 2006, 05:09:47 PM

The Father is called Shadrack?!?!??!!? Or just the "
ultimate villain" party? Or is the Father with his shapeshifting abilities Shadrack in disguise?!!?! Or....OR! Maybe the Father is the reverent term for Shadrack since he is the creator of the Black Cloak Society which has members from all the KQs working together to try to conquer daventry?!?!?!?!?

Baggins · February 19, 2006, 07:26:43 PM

Well in KQ2+ storyline the Father was once "Morgeilen", who coveted his brother Legenimor's power. You have to look carefully at various hints scattered throughout the story to find that information in the game though.

...of course this is a character that seems to thrive on alternate identities if "Gervain" is any indication. For all we know maybe a later AGDI game could have Shadrack just being just another of Morgeilen's identities he uses.

Elessar · February 25, 2006, 11:27:01 AM

Quote from: awesomeasapossum on February 16, 2006, 05:09:47 PM
The Father is called Shadrack?!?!??!!? Or just the "
ultimate villain" party? Or is the Father with his shapeshifting abilities Shadrack in disguise?!!?! Or....OR! Maybe the Father is the reverent term for Shadrack since he is the creator of the Black Cloak Society which has members from all the KQs working together to try to conquer daventry?!?!?!?!?

Yes! Maybe Shadrack IS the head of the Black Cloak Society, and all the bad guys from all the KQs band together to forever eliminate the Royal Line of Daventry!

So Graham goes on a quest to get Crispin and the rest of the good guys to create a White Cloak Society to fight back the black!

awesomeasapossum · February 25, 2006, 12:46:42 PM

Actually it'd be the silver cloak society. And what about this picture:

Erik · February 25, 2006, 01:47:46 PM

Quote from: Elessar on February 25, 2006, 11:27:01 AM
Quote from: awesomeasapossum on February 16, 2006, 05:09:47 PM
The Father is called Shadrack?!?!??!!? Or just the "
ultimate villain" party? Or is the Father with his shapeshifting abilities Shadrack in disguise?!!?! Or....OR! Maybe the Father is the reverent term for Shadrack since he is the creator of the Black Cloak Society which has members from all the KQs working together to try to conquer daventry?!?!?!?!?
Yes! Maybe Shadrack IS the head of the Black Cloak Society, and all the bad guys from all the KQs band together to forever eliminate the Royal Line of Daventry! So Graham goes on a quest to get Crispin and the rest of the good guys to create a White Cloak Society to fight back the black!

I dunno. That seems a little far-fetched.

Yonkey · February 25, 2006, 01:52:52 PM

Quote from: awesomeasapossum on February 25, 2006, 12:46:42 PM
Actually it'd be the silver cloak society. And what about this picture:

A black square? Do you mean there's also a Black Square Society?

awesomeasapossum · February 25, 2006, 03:19:08 PM

Sorry. Whenever I try to take a screenshot (CTRL Print Screen) of the part of the "making of" with the two "army" type things (it's on a scroll during the choral part) It doesn't work. Whenever I keep playing the video it changes the video (Like i'm watching the video in microsoft word) and then when I exit it turns black.

awesomeasapossum · February 25, 2006, 03:28:35 PM

I'm going to try with Windows Movie Maker 2. Oh and, if you have seen the video and know what I'm talking about maybe it's showing the BCS VS the SCS.

Cez · February 25, 2006, 11:38:46 PM

I'll be good and say that's pre-societies history

Yeah, you better believe me when I say the story for this game is LONG.

koko_99_2001 · February 26, 2006, 05:50:36 AM

Quote from: César_Bittar on February 25, 2006, 11:38:46 PM
I'll be good and say that's pre-societies history

Yeah, you better believe me when I say the story for this game is LONG.

Don't I remember something about the script being HUGE??

awesomeasapossum · February 26, 2006, 04:17:48 PM

1,000+ pages IIRC.

Dangling Participle · March 04, 2006, 12:47:09 AM

where can i find that making of? is it available online?

Yonkey · March 04, 2006, 06:42:49 AM

Yup. Check out this post.

Baggins · March 04, 2006, 10:26:43 AM

Let's also not forget about the mysterious "Society of Wizards" mentioned in KQ5. They too seem to be against Dark Magic, and evil villainy. Though we hardly know anything about them as far as official lore goes.

I'm curious if KQIX's SCS is based on them.

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"The Father" and other questions...