Author Topic: The Black Cloak Society  (Read 20128 times)

Offline Baggins

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Re: The Black Cloak Society
« Reply #20 on: April 22, 2006, 05:00:33 PM »
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"In the companion it says Hagatha is Mordack's sister and she's a member of the BCS aswell."

No, only the KQ5 chapter says Hagatha is Mordack's and Manannan's sister(a fact later put into the King's Questions trivia program). The trivia is unrelated to info about the Black Cloak Society. The book  never says she is part of the Black Cloak Society. It never states Manannan is part of the black cloak either.

The Hagatha fact is mentioned only in KQ5 chapter of the book which was written long before KQ6 was even in production(It was published in the 2nd edition of the companion). At that time the idea for the Black Cloak didn't even exist.

The only refrence to the Black Cloak in the book shows up in the 3rd edition when KQ6 chapters were added to the book, and the only black cloak refrence that exists in the companion is in refrence to the letters between Shadrack and Abdul, the same letters you can hear/find in the game. As well as the refrence to the black cloak in Abdul's office, that can be seen through the peep hole(said to be of dire signifigance).

The black cloaks in Abdul's wardrobe aren't even mentioned in the companion, but rather it just discusses the "silken  robes", "unclean hose", and "strong perfumes" that Abdul keeps in the wardrobe.

The letters that mention the black cloak, are somewhat different(a bit longer and more detailed) then how they ended up in the game. However just like in the game there is no refrence to Hagatha, or Manannan. Only Mordack is mentioned in the letters.

Some interesting details that the extended versions of the letters hint at, is that Shadrack's has "peculiar interests", implying that he would have used her body for lecherous purposes, alive or dead, and further clues on what the black cloak's ultimate plans for the kingdom was(ultimate destruction).

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Well, if Roberta had more control over moe, maybe it might not have been the disaster it is.  I would like to see a remake of moe, with a story to it.  Somebody should remake moe as a true adventure game.


As for more actual facts surrounding what screwed up MOE?


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Yes, this was the only KQ game that was not fully developed at one location. The idea was to leverage the 3D engine Dynamic was building in Eugene. We were to use their engine and focus mostly on content. The problem was that the engine work ended up WAY behind schedule and that had disastrous results on our content development. To make a long story short, we finally took what they had and finished it ourselves. Unfortunately, by the time we did this the project was way behind schedule, way over budget, and we still didn't have an engine. We scrambled to complete the project and it unfortunately showed. It saddens me to have had the King's Quest series end with a product that suffered so.
So yes, many things were cut - the leprechaun, the Red Capped goblin, I think two complete levels, and then MANY major cutbacks on what is there. As you point out, a good example is the Swamp Witch. In the original script as it was developing, her part was much larger. But as we had to devote time to technical issues, the esthetic issues and the amount of detail and breadth of content continued to get chopped. Remember, this was also right at the time the industry was saying that "Adventure gaming is dead." It was not easy to convince marketing to invest more to develop an adventure game. The end result was that we shipped what we could, and it was a pretty sad showing for such a great series.
-Mark Seibert, March 11, 2006.
« Last Edit: April 23, 2006, 07:36:41 AM by Baggins »
Well, ya, King's Quest is on Earth. Daventry is very old city from a long time ago. It's in ruins now and people aren't quite sure exactly where it used to be. There are some archaeologists searching through the ruins, they think they know its Daventry. But its somewhere on Earth."-Roberta Williams http://kingsquest.wikia.com/wiki/File:Daventryisearth.ogg

Offline TribeHasSpoken

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Re: The Black Cloak Society
« Reply #21 on: April 24, 2006, 01:34:23 AM »
I feel too much of this thread is deviating from the topic of the Black Cloak Society and instead discussing other aspects of the KQ universe. I'll leave the thread along for the moment, but if it continues I'll either move the posts into a new thread or merge them into a more appropriate existing thread.

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« Last Edit: April 24, 2006, 01:48:29 AM by TribeHasSpoken »
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Offline dark-daventry

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Re: The Black Cloak Society
« Reply #22 on: April 24, 2006, 11:51:56 AM »
They should redo the MoE game with the original story intact, and say the original MoE was either an alternate reality, or plain fan-fiction!

But back on Topic!

Does the Black Cloak Society have any new members besides the ones we know/suspect to be in it? (Cedric excluded! We all know he's in it secretly, so there is no reason to say so!) Also, does Crispin make an appearance, and if so, does he have any significance to the storyline, or is he just a side character?
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Offline Elessar

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Re: The Black Cloak Society
« Reply #23 on: April 26, 2006, 08:04:13 AM »
Does the Black Cloak Society have any new members besides the ones we know/suspect to be in it?
I'm sure Shadrack will be one of the members - if not the chief one! :evil: :)
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Renewed shall be blade that was broken
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Offline jam3s

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Re: The Black Cloak Society
« Reply #24 on: June 03, 2006, 02:32:31 PM »
I wonder if the various witches throught the games have belonged to the black cloak society, or if it is just the wizards. If the witches for some reason werent allowed to join, one would assume they had their own society, but I think it would be interesting if every villan invloved in the games belonged to the BCS.
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Offline Deloria

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Re: The Black Cloak Society
« Reply #25 on: June 03, 2006, 02:56:14 PM »
Hagatha didn't, and I don't think Dahlia, or the witch in the dark forest did.
 
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Offline Baggins

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Re: The Black Cloak Society
« Reply #26 on: June 03, 2006, 03:30:56 PM »
According to Roberta there was no connection to the Black Cloak between any of the characters from previous games. Infact she really didn't have any ideas for a so called "Black Cloak Society".

The idea of "Society of the Black Cloak" was purely something Jane Jenson came up with. Jane Jenson wasn't involved with any of the earliest games.
Well, ya, King's Quest is on Earth. Daventry is very old city from a long time ago. It's in ruins now and people aren't quite sure exactly where it used to be. There are some archaeologists searching through the ruins, they think they know its Daventry. But its somewhere on Earth."-Roberta Williams http://kingsquest.wikia.com/wiki/File:Daventryisearth.ogg

Offline Deloria

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Re: The Black Cloak Society
« Reply #27 on: June 03, 2006, 04:12:17 PM »
I know. But we can deduce (from Jane Jenson) that Manannan, Mordack, Abdul and Shadrack were in it.
 
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Offline Baggins

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Re: The Black Cloak Society
« Reply #28 on: June 04, 2006, 05:34:25 PM »
Well its definite with Mordack, Shadrack, and Alhazred.

Manannan is an unknown, and he has never explicitely been stated to be connected to the black cloak society by any official source. Though he is connected to Mordack by being his brother.

Hagatha has a connection to Mordack and Alhazred(though not by Roberta herself) as their sister in official material. But there is no explicit  evidence she is also connected to the Black Cloak society either by any of the programmers or writers that connected her to brothers.
« Last Edit: June 04, 2006, 05:45:21 PM by Baggins »
Well, ya, King's Quest is on Earth. Daventry is very old city from a long time ago. It's in ruins now and people aren't quite sure exactly where it used to be. There are some archaeologists searching through the ruins, they think they know its Daventry. But its somewhere on Earth."-Roberta Williams http://kingsquest.wikia.com/wiki/File:Daventryisearth.ogg

Offline Rosedragon

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Re: The Black Cloak Society
« Reply #29 on: June 05, 2006, 11:36:55 AM »
In my fanfiction, all of the villains in the KQ games are involved in the Black Cloak Society.  Shadrack is the leader of the BCS. Please read my stories. 


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Offline lil_saintmc

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Re: The Black Cloak Society
« Reply #30 on: February 23, 2007, 04:22:02 AM »
But if you think about it, how many members are left? Ok, Mordack was evaporated, Mannannan is a cat, Alhazred is in prison, and then theres Shadrack. The team also said that they would keep to the original story line. So they can't include members into the black cloak society for example THE FATHER! Unless Shadrack is the Father. Personally, I believe that Mordack will stay dead, Hagatha will return to take Valinice, Mannannan will return to human form but with cat eyes to make him super scary, Alhazred will get out of the slammer. So a final conclusion; Villans will likely be Shadrack, Alhazred, Mannannan and Hagatha. Thats it.

Offline Bludshot

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Re: The Black Cloak Society
« Reply #31 on: March 23, 2007, 03:28:52 PM »
But if you think about it, how many members are left? Ok, Mordack was evaporated, Mannannan is a cat, Alhazred is in prison, and then theres Shadrack. The team also said that they would keep to the original story line. So they can't include members into the black cloak society for example THE FATHER! Unless Shadrack is the Father. Personally, I believe that Mordack will stay dead, Hagatha will return to take Valinice, Mannannan will return to human form but with cat eyes to make him super scary, Alhazred will get out of the slammer. So a final conclusion; Villans will likely be Shadrack, Alhazred, Mannannan and Hagatha. Thats it.

I doubt The Father will have anything to do with KQIX, as he is a non canon character (but still cool).
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Offline PirateKingChris

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Re: The Black Cloak Society
« Reply #32 on: March 29, 2007, 02:31:36 PM »
I think you're right.....but I hope Mannannan is still a cat so we can kick his scary butt around  :sneaky:
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Offline awesomeasapossum

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Re: The Black Cloak Society
« Reply #33 on: March 29, 2007, 03:19:16 PM »
Scary butt? Did you have a traumatic experience with a cat and its...erm...rear end when you were a child? ;D
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Offline PirateKingChris

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Re: The Black Cloak Society
« Reply #34 on: March 29, 2007, 03:37:19 PM »
No, I was referring to Mannannan being scary, as a man...So you can take advantage of him being a cat and kicking him...Not that I'd ever kick a REAL cat...I love kitties, I have one :P
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Offline tessspoon

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Re: The Black Cloak Society
« Reply #35 on: March 29, 2007, 03:56:54 PM »
Even as cat I don't know that I would want to fight Manannan (personally, anyway, I have no problems with making the character do it ;D). Their claws really hurt sometimes. :P

Offline PirateKingChris

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Re: The Black Cloak Society
« Reply #36 on: March 29, 2007, 03:59:53 PM »
Sometimes even my own cat is a meanie :P

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Offline Nilan

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Re: The Black Cloak Society
« Reply #37 on: April 02, 2007, 05:19:40 PM »
Y'know, who says Shadrack is the only new villian, hm? ;)

Offline Elessar

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Re: The Black Cloak Society
« Reply #38 on: April 04, 2007, 04:26:24 PM »
Y'know, who says Shadrack is the only new villian, hm? ;)

Good point. After all, one of the songs is called "Nightmary's Theme", so is Nightmary a good character or bad?

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As her name explains it, she's quite "a dark lady" into what her structure is in the game ;D

(Quote from Say in this thread)
All that is gold does not glitter
Not all who wander are lost
The old that is strong does not wither
Deep roots are not touched by the frost

From the ashes a fire shall be woken
A light from the shadows shall spring
Renewed shall be blade that was broken
The crownless again shall be king


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Offline Baggins

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Re: The Black Cloak Society
« Reply #39 on: April 07, 2007, 01:39:28 AM »
Point of note that The Father was, Morgeilen, brother of Legenimor (first king of Daventry), not Shadrack :), in the unofficial KQ2 remake.

Although you have to find some imbedded information in the game to discover that fact.
Well, ya, King's Quest is on Earth. Daventry is very old city from a long time ago. It's in ruins now and people aren't quite sure exactly where it used to be. There are some archaeologists searching through the ruins, they think they know its Daventry. But its somewhere on Earth."-Roberta Williams http://kingsquest.wikia.com/wiki/File:Daventryisearth.ogg