Author Topic: Timelines, Age and Death  (Read 15611 times)

Offline Baggins

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Timelines, Age and Death
« on: July 20, 2006, 11:43:19 PM »
Below exists a discussion from some earlier threads, discussing some differences between TSL's King's Quest timeline, and the official one, and a discussion brought up over the differences in Graham's age in both timelines, in the future it can be used to discuss any number of differences between all the various timelines, from various fan game teams, and the official one;

In TSL timeline Graham is in his 50-60s, and events of Mask were moved back to not long after KQ7.

Where as in official timeline, and the Sierra designers original intent, Graham was in his 70-80's in Mask of Eternity, thus why he looked all frail and wrinkly in the cutscenes. The game was intended to take place a few decades after KQ7, apparently."
-Quoting myself.
« Last Edit: July 21, 2006, 08:23:09 PM by Baggins »
Well, ya, King's Quest is on Earth. Daventry is very old city from a long time ago. It's in ruins now and people aren't quite sure exactly where it used to be. There are some archaeologists searching through the ruins, they think they know its Daventry. But its somewhere on Earth."-Roberta Williams http://kingsquest.wikia.com/wiki/File:Daventryisearth.ogg

Offline Baggins

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Re: Timelines and age
« Reply #1 on: July 21, 2006, 01:30:00 PM »
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"So then TSL is supposed to be befoer MOE which would make it 7.5 or should I say. VII.V "

Well that could have worked, except POS's timeline puts MOE before TSL, and has connor, sarah, and apparently the mask in TSL. So they simply choose to ignore that Graham was a frail old man in that game  ;D. Instead making him much younger so he could conceivably go on adventures again heh heh.

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Blame it on the bad graphics. 


Sure I know you are being sarcastic  :suffer:, LOL.
 
But, no, I mean it that was actually the intent of the designers, that graham was old in the game, according to an interview I had with Mark Seibert, thus why the tried to make him appear frail and wrinkled in the cutscenes, and in his stone form.

It would seem they wanted Graham to be in such a state that he wouldn't have been capable to save the kingdom even if he had escaped the curse, so they could bring in a fresh young and new adventurer to save the kingdom...

 I suppose its somewhat mirrors KQ1, in that Edward was elderly, and Graham came in as next generation to save the land.
« Last Edit: July 21, 2006, 01:38:00 PM by Baggins »
Well, ya, King's Quest is on Earth. Daventry is very old city from a long time ago. It's in ruins now and people aren't quite sure exactly where it used to be. There are some archaeologists searching through the ruins, they think they know its Daventry. But its somewhere on Earth."-Roberta Williams http://kingsquest.wikia.com/wiki/File:Daventryisearth.ogg

Offline Shades2585

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Re: Timelines and age
« Reply #2 on: July 21, 2006, 02:49:48 PM »
OK I thought it was supposed to be after MOE.

That's the problem with phasing out a character that everyone likes and bringing in a new. It can fail if knowone likes the new person.
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Offline Yonkey

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Re: Timelines and age
« Reply #3 on: July 21, 2006, 04:52:13 PM »
So they simply choose to ignore that Graham was a frail old man in that game  ;D.
Didn't you know?  He ate some of that magic fruit Rosella had frozen for him back in KQIV. ;-D
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Offline Deloria

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Re: Timelines and age
« Reply #4 on: July 21, 2006, 05:27:39 PM »
So they simply choose to ignore that Graham was a frail old man in that game  ;D.
Didn't you know?  He ate some of that magic fruit Rosella had frozen for him back in KQIV. ;-D

Which they stored in the freezer and which is three years old? :P
 
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TheReturnofDMD

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Re: Timelines and age
« Reply #5 on: July 21, 2006, 06:05:38 PM »
In MOE's case you have to blame the bad graphics and butchered story. Look at the intro scene, Graham looks in his late 40s-mid 50s easily, and his hair is cut short and he's a little heavy with a mustache. But in the closing cutscene he looks frail. That game is messed up, and I think that in any event Graham is the age TSL has him at.

Offline Baggins

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Re: Timelines and age
« Reply #6 on: July 21, 2006, 06:22:42 PM »
Oh, so they all the family shared it, as well as all other non-immortal returning characters, including Connor and Sarah, each getting back 20-30 years of their lives, LOL. So TSL really takes place 20  plus years after KQ7.  :suffer: :p

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Which they stored in the freezer and which is three years old?


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« Last Edit: July 21, 2006, 06:35:57 PM by Baggins »
Well, ya, King's Quest is on Earth. Daventry is very old city from a long time ago. It's in ruins now and people aren't quite sure exactly where it used to be. There are some archaeologists searching through the ruins, they think they know its Daventry. But its somewhere on Earth."-Roberta Williams http://kingsquest.wikia.com/wiki/File:Daventryisearth.ogg

Offline Baggins

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Re: Timelines and age
« Reply #7 on: July 21, 2006, 06:24:13 PM »
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In MOE's case you have to blame the bad graphics and butchered story.

Actually I'm serious I interviewed the producer of the game Mark Seibert. He said that the team's intent was Graham was old man thus why the intentionally tried to make him look frail and elderly. It had nothing to do with graphics. They wanted the game to take place decades or so after KQ7.

It was to kind of mirror where KQ1 started, and bring the series in a circle. An elderly King, a forsaken kingdom, being saved by a young new adventurer. The next generation so to speak...
« Last Edit: July 21, 2006, 06:48:14 PM by Baggins »
Well, ya, King's Quest is on Earth. Daventry is very old city from a long time ago. It's in ruins now and people aren't quite sure exactly where it used to be. There are some archaeologists searching through the ruins, they think they know its Daventry. But its somewhere on Earth."-Roberta Williams http://kingsquest.wikia.com/wiki/File:Daventryisearth.ogg

Offline Shades2585

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Re: Timelines and age
« Reply #8 on: July 21, 2006, 06:35:35 PM »
I believe you. It makes sense actually and it will make more sense as soon as I play VI, VII, and VIII but I'll keep that in mind when I play the last. ;D
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Bring WORMY BACK!!!!!!!

Offline Yonkey

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Re: Timelines and age
« Reply #9 on: July 21, 2006, 07:31:46 PM »
So TSL really takes place 20  plus years after KQ7.  :suffer: :p
20?  I thought KQ7 came out in 1994. ;P

*feels a topic split coming on*
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Offline Petra Rocks

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Re: Timelines and age
« Reply #10 on: July 21, 2006, 07:57:48 PM »
 I always knew there was a reason to get rid of Conner.  ;)  Seriously, that is going to be hard to explain away, probably best just to pretend it never happened.   :-X

Offline Baggins

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Re: Timelines and age
« Reply #11 on: July 21, 2006, 08:01:24 PM »
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"20?  I thought KQ7 came out in 1994."

I was joking about 20 years ahead in the Daventry Universe, not when the game's were produced heh heh.

I was thinking... Its kind of morbid but maybe the reason why Derek Karlavaegen was not capable of sending out an account of the events of MOE to anyone by use of the Eye Between the World, was because perhaps he had died of old age before the time the event took place...  :P
« Last Edit: July 21, 2006, 09:25:45 PM by Baggins »
Well, ya, King's Quest is on Earth. Daventry is very old city from a long time ago. It's in ruins now and people aren't quite sure exactly where it used to be. There are some archaeologists searching through the ruins, they think they know its Daventry. But its somewhere on Earth."-Roberta Williams http://kingsquest.wikia.com/wiki/File:Daventryisearth.ogg

TheReturnofDMD

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Re: Timelines and age
« Reply #12 on: July 22, 2006, 09:07:51 PM »
Personally, I put MOE in the timeframe that TSL timeline has it...I mean, what the MOE's team intended and what actually came out are too different things no? Just ask Ken and Roberta Williams....
Besides, the portraits of Valanice and Graham in MOE are the ones from KQ6...I doubt they'd still have 20 year old portraits of themselves on the wall, more likely newer ones.

Offline Baggins

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Re: Timelines and age
« Reply #13 on: July 22, 2006, 09:49:13 PM »
Actually what came out officially was that it was set decades after KQ7, thus why Graham looks old and wrinkled in the game. That's according to the main producer himself.


He even looks old to me in the early cutscene IMO.

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KQ6...I doubt they'd still have 20 year old portraits of themselves on the wall, more likely newer ones."

Actually its generally the rule in royal circles and rich people in history for portraits to be of the youngest or best looking possible appearance of a person. They were never updated as it gave the illusion of youthfullness and acted as a memory for who the person was in life. Its a way of gaining a certain level of immortality.

Infact a certain level of innaccuracy occured in order to make a person look better than they actually did, to put them in best light.

Even when they had more than one painting commisioned for important events and ceremonies artists kept artistic interprentation of more youthful good looking individuals, than how the person actually looked.




That being said its absolutely fine for fan designers, and or even fanfic writers to reinterpret the stories for the sake of their own stories if it better fits the the kind of story they are trying to tell.
« Last Edit: July 23, 2006, 01:23:05 PM by Baggins »
Well, ya, King's Quest is on Earth. Daventry is very old city from a long time ago. It's in ruins now and people aren't quite sure exactly where it used to be. There are some archaeologists searching through the ruins, they think they know its Daventry. But its somewhere on Earth."-Roberta Williams http://kingsquest.wikia.com/wiki/File:Daventryisearth.ogg

Offline Baggins

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Re: Timelines and age
« Reply #14 on: July 23, 2006, 09:18:33 PM »
Ahh, I thought I'd contrast KQ2 (AGDI) timeline for a moment and mention that as for as its MOE sequence, it decided to go with the official timeline and put Graham in the game as an elderly man, and much the same appearance as he was in MOE.

Though obviously most  of the game was much different than the official timeline.
« Last Edit: July 24, 2006, 12:48:12 AM by Baggins »
Well, ya, King's Quest is on Earth. Daventry is very old city from a long time ago. It's in ruins now and people aren't quite sure exactly where it used to be. There are some archaeologists searching through the ruins, they think they know its Daventry. But its somewhere on Earth."-Roberta Williams http://kingsquest.wikia.com/wiki/File:Daventryisearth.ogg

TheReturnofDMD

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Re: Timelines and age
« Reply #15 on: July 23, 2006, 09:57:23 PM »
       Ok well there is some possibility that in MOE Graham  not that old...I mean, in TSL, he doesn't appear that young looking and if I recall correctly Genesta said that partaking of the Magic Fruit would give him health, strength and well being for many years...
         Not only that but I was reading an interview with Roberta from 1997 or 1998 and she hinted at the possibility of Rosella perhaps marrying Conner...Now, if MOE takes place 20 or so years after KQ7, Rosella would have been well past marrying age in a medieval society. Even in the King's Quest world, in KQ7, Rosella is nearly 20 years old and she would soon be considered an ''old maid'' if she didn't marry. Now add twenty years to that and Rosella is about 40 or so...So, it just doesn't make sense to me.
« Last Edit: July 23, 2006, 10:07:24 PM by TheReturnofDMD »

Offline Boogeyman

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Re: Timelines and age
« Reply #16 on: July 23, 2006, 10:28:28 PM »
       Not only that but I was reading an interview with Roberta from 1997 or 1998 and she hinted at the possibility of Rosella perhaps marrying Conner...Now, if MOE takes place 20 or so years after KQ7, Rosella would have been well past marrying age in a medieval society. Even in the King's Quest world, in KQ7, Rosella is nearly 20 years old and she would soon be considered an ''old maid'' if she didn't marry. Now add twenty years to that and Rosella is about 40 or so...So, it just doesn't make sense to me.


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Offline Baggins

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Re: Timelines and age
« Reply #17 on: July 23, 2006, 11:27:52 PM »
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Not only that but I was reading an interview with Roberta from 1997 or 1998 and she hinted at the possibility of Rosella perhaps marrying Conner...

Roberta's comment wasn't "marrying" connor it was "meeting connor", it was in reply to the interviewer who was wondering if Rosella would marry connor, or if she was with Edgar.

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Perhaps in some future King's Quest game, Connor will at least meet Rosella!
-Robert Williams

That really didn't apply to "when", she could have easily been married to Edgar already. Also note that the interview was made before the game was even released.


Graham was about 44 years old in KQ6-7(he was 19 at the start of KQ1), according to the official timeline. Both KQ6 and KQ7 occured during the same year in the official timeline. So if at least a decade had passed between KQ7 and MOE, graham would be about 54.

 BTW I'd have to do the math again but there is about a 2 year difference from that of TSL's version of the timeline, he's 42 or so during KQ6, 43 or so at the time of KQ7 and MOE. KQ7 and MoE are placed during the same year, only a month apart.  They have events of TSL taking place about one year later, so that makes Graham about 44 in their timeline during TSL. If we assume his age was 19 during start of KQ1 in their timeline.

BTW, the TSL timeline doesn't entirely match up with the official timeline anyways, as they didn't always follow when the manuals, or official guides said each game took place.

Plus they have events of each game usually taking place over an entire month or more(KQ1 for example takes place over the course of 6 months in their timeline), where as in official timelines the events of most of the games usually only took a day or two at the most(KQ1 for example only took place over 2-3 days). So the years don't always match up. They are largely inconsequential differences, and do not affect the stories themselves, but they do make the timelines different from each other.

 In TSL's timeline he doesn't appear much older than he appeared in KQ6, he looks largely the same, its not like there would be much of a change in 2 years in which POS placed the events in their timeline. Compared to how he looks in MOE, Graham looks like a spring chicken in TSL.
« Last Edit: July 24, 2006, 09:45:18 AM by Baggins »
Well, ya, King's Quest is on Earth. Daventry is very old city from a long time ago. It's in ruins now and people aren't quite sure exactly where it used to be. There are some archaeologists searching through the ruins, they think they know its Daventry. But its somewhere on Earth."-Roberta Williams http://kingsquest.wikia.com/wiki/File:Daventryisearth.ogg

TheReturnofDMD

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Re: Timelines and age
« Reply #18 on: July 24, 2006, 04:24:09 PM »
Graham was about 44 years old in KQ6-7(he was 19 at the start of KQ1), according to the official timeline. Both KQ6 and KQ7 occured during the same year in the official timeline. So if at least a decade had passed between KQ7 and MOE, graham would be about 54.

I remember somebody, perhaps somebody on the team, not sure though, saying a while back that Graham was like 52 in TSL.
« Last Edit: August 08, 2006, 03:44:09 PM by Deloria »

Offline Baggins

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Re: Timelines and age
« Reply #19 on: July 24, 2006, 06:25:33 PM »
If he is 52 in TSL then they are assuming he was 27 in King's Quest 1, going by the dates in their timeline. Which also is a difference between their timeline and the official one.

Graham was 19 in KQ1 in the official timeline, and therefore 44, at the time of King's Quest 6 and 7 (both take place during the same year).
« Last Edit: July 24, 2006, 06:31:04 PM by Baggins »
Well, ya, King's Quest is on Earth. Daventry is very old city from a long time ago. It's in ruins now and people aren't quite sure exactly where it used to be. There are some archaeologists searching through the ruins, they think they know its Daventry. But its somewhere on Earth."-Roberta Williams http://kingsquest.wikia.com/wiki/File:Daventryisearth.ogg
 

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