Author Topic: PCs  (Read 28246 times)

Offline copycat

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Re:PCs
« Reply #60 on: April 02, 2004, 01:34:07 PM »
Copycat, I would suggest you think about being an architect for a minute.
If I had been good in technical drawing, I wouldn't be a bookkeeper now. ::)

Check out the eeye.com website to see how many security flaws the NT code still have that have been discovered.
Where on that site does it say that 98SE is any better (in the same circumstances) ??? I mean, put a NT-machine and a 98SE-machine next to each other, let them do the same thing, no patching allowed, and see which one of the two has the most security flaws. I'm not saying what you say isn't true, but I have yet to see any proof.
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Offline dew7

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Re:PCs
« Reply #61 on: April 02, 2004, 01:34:54 PM »
  So, Copycat is Linux more secure than the NT and 9x Microsoft code   ???
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Offline copycat

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Re:PCs
« Reply #62 on: April 02, 2004, 01:51:28 PM »
 So, Copycat is Linux more secure than the NT and 9x Microsoft code   ???
I'll let you know as soon as Linux is working properly. :-X
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Offline etgadsby

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Re:PCs
« Reply #63 on: April 02, 2004, 03:06:51 PM »
First off some facts:
-The current version of the xbox runs is essentially a PC (a 733MHz PIII) running a custom Windows 2000 (sorry that’s NT boy and girls) core, with a special 3D menuing system. The system is rather slow but a lot has been done to the graphics and memory busses to “throttle” performance. You can read the all about it here: http://www.xbreporter.com/xbox_system_specifications.php

-Secondly I think I need to point out a key difference between Windows 9x (and Mac OS Classic) and  Windows NT, 2000, XP, Linux, Mac OS X and the father of them all UNIX.  Windows 9x and Mac OS Classic are single user OS’s while the rest are multi-user operating systems. These systems network by nature where Windows 9x and Mac OS Classic had to be upgraded to include networking capacities. Multi-user systems are meant to be legitimately accessed over a network by registered users with valid accounts. Needless to say this opens lots of holes for malicious activities…viruses, worms, and hackers.

-Third, Linux (which is a very close cousin of UNIX) is not secure (See point 2) until YOU secure it… the same with Mac OS X or the much beleaguered (in this thread)Windows XP.

Ok, My Thoughts On “Windows 98 Third Edition”:

In this discussion there are two issues coming up: “Does XP suck?” and “Does XP suck for games?”.  For the sake of brevity (Oh well…I’m well past that already) I’ll stick with “does XP suck”, and the answer is that it does. It’s a hack based on what was essentially going to be OS3 (remember OS2 from IBM) that M$ won/bought as apart of a long since defunct alliance.  It is full of holes some of them are M$ created or neglected to find but some are pitfalls of this multi-user OS thing I’ve been talking about.

“Windows 98 Third Edition” will NEVER happen. The age of the multi-user, internet ready OS is here and I think it’s safe to say it’s staying.  Dew7 I understand your frustration, we have a lot of users where I work who find themselves very frustrated by the added complexities (headaches) that a multi-user/network enabled OS give them. For them there’s no such thing as “off the internet” anymore. For us we constantly have to be aware that even a secretary’s computer is essentially a “server” and may be under attack by a hacker or worm.

Dew7, I both agree with you and I don’t… I think XP and the way M$ chooses to develop software is a problem. I also know what a problem old and outdated OS’s can cause, for various reasons we still have 98 boxes in my environment and they cause  a LOT of problems.  

I don’t like XP, but more 98 isn’t the solution… as I see it you have two choices: find ways to demand more from M$ (see if you can help test Longhorn and be sent betas) or begin to try out alternative OS’s like Mac OS X (my preference) or Linux, both of these are robust standards based OS’s that can be easily secured.

As for XP and games… I’ll let somebody else comment on that and be quiet a while…
« Last Edit: April 02, 2004, 03:13:20 PM by etgadsby »
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Offline copycat

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Re:PCs
« Reply #64 on: April 02, 2004, 03:28:03 PM »
Etgadsby, so, is a singlu-user OS upgraded with networking capacities more secure than a multi-user OS?
« Last Edit: April 02, 2004, 03:28:18 PM by copycat »
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Offline etgadsby

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Re:PCs
« Reply #65 on: April 02, 2004, 03:44:51 PM »
It sort of is in the respect that if it’s added as some sort of plug-in, library, or extension it can also be subtracted. Both Win9x and Mac OS Classic could easily have their networking capabilities turned off by the user.  

Mult-user systems are odd because they provide a lot of great features (most web sites run on UNIX systems) that help so many but literally a whole industry is emerging in locking them down so a given PC/Mac/server is able to serve it’s function (whatever that is) without being exploited for nefarious purposes.   :-\
« Last Edit: April 02, 2004, 03:46:50 PM by etgadsby »
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Offline dew7

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Re:PCs
« Reply #66 on: April 03, 2004, 08:16:28 AM »
   So who likes and uses the google toolbar?
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Offline Jeysie

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Re:PCs
« Reply #67 on: April 03, 2004, 11:13:15 AM »
As near as I can tell, almost all of the Google Toolbar functionality has been already built into Opera for some time, so I don't need it. ;D

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Offline copycat

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Re:PCs
« Reply #68 on: April 03, 2004, 02:34:02 PM »
So who likes and uses the google toolbar?
I see no use for it. ;P
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Offline Storm

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Re:PCs
« Reply #69 on: April 03, 2004, 06:02:36 PM »
Don't use it either... If I want to google, I just go there :)
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Offline Yonkey

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Re:PCs
« Reply #70 on: April 03, 2004, 06:06:58 PM »
I find it faster than going to google's site itself.  But obviously if I'm using a school computer or something then I just go there manually.  Ugh, but after the 8 hours of googling we did today at school, I should have definitely installed the toolbar there lol. :P  Oh yeah, like I said earlier, I like how it has a pop-up blocker too.  :)
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Offline copycat

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Re:PCs
« Reply #71 on: April 04, 2004, 10:14:27 AM »
This is what the Google Toolbar is supposed to do:
 â€˘     Search the web with Google from any site
 â€˘    Eliminate pop-up ads
 â€˘    Fill in forms with one click
 â€˘    Highlight search terms on a page

a) Search the web with google from any site: my browser
b) Eliminate pop-up ads: also my browser
c) Fill in forms with one click: my browser does form-handling too
d) Highlight search terms on a page: I can read, so if I want to search for something, I don't want to rely on any other program telling me what I should search for. 8)
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Offline Jeysie

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Re:PCs
« Reply #72 on: April 04, 2004, 11:39:23 AM »
Yep, I was right. ;D

Search the web with google from any site: I can do any search I want to set up straight from my browser's address bar. I can even set up searches that search more than one engine at once, if I want.

Eliminate pop-up ads: Built-in to my browser.

Fill in forms with one click: My browser has a variety of form fields you can set up with information to use to fill-in forms. You can even set up custom stuff using the Notes feature. (I have my little sig in a note now, hee.)

Highlight search terms on a page: This my browser does not do, but there's perfectly good "Find" and "Find as you type" features. ;D

IMHO, Google Toolbar is for those IE folks who just won't switch to a better browser. ;)

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Offline copycat

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Re:PCs
« Reply #73 on: April 04, 2004, 02:42:05 PM »
IMHO, Google Toolbar is for those IE folks who just won't switch to a better browser. ;)
I fully agree, and I don't even have Opera. ;D
Hmm, would that Toolbar work in Konqueror? 8)
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Offline Jeysie

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Re:PCs
« Reply #74 on: April 04, 2004, 02:49:45 PM »
I fully agree, and I don't even have Opera. ;D

Well, you use FireFox on your Windows Box, IIRC, which is still better than IE. ;) (Whether Opera or Mozilla/FireFox is better is a matter of personal taste anyway.)

Hmm, would that Toolbar work in Konqueror?

Dunno... does Konqueror need it?

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Offline Say

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Re:PCs
« Reply #75 on: April 04, 2004, 03:59:43 PM »
*bi.tches are her pc*  >:(

*sets pc on fire*  :lovegoggles:


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Offline copycat

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Re:PCs
« Reply #76 on: April 04, 2004, 04:11:39 PM »
*bi.tches are her pc*  >:(

*sets pc on fire*  :lovegoggles:
Now now Say, don't be so drastic. Maybe you should buy a new pc as a replacement first? ::)
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Offline etgadsby

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Re:PCs
« Reply #77 on: April 04, 2004, 07:48:05 PM »
PC’s on fire? That’s odd, I’ve been reading a book for A+ certification that suggests that a the best troubleshooting method for a “PC with flames shooting six feet out of the top of the monitor” is to and I quote “run out of the building screaming”  ... ???

As for the Google Bar… I use Safari (heavily based on Konqueror) on my PowerBook and it has both a search bar and pop-up blocker built in. That’s what I have to say about that…  :)
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Offline etgadsby

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Re:PCs
« Reply #78 on: April 05, 2004, 10:59:54 AM »
Do you want to know what I think or what I am the industry is telling me?

Generally speaking “I think” folks should cozy up to Mac OS X, perhaps that’s an argument for porting it to the x86 platform (Steve Jobs did you hear me?) . It’s more stable, nice and easy to use, and generally free of all this BS I see on Windows.  Linux is another alternative but until somebody rewrites XWindows (the utterly antique subsystem that powers GNOME and friends) that won’t work for the average Joe…

The reason I keep pointing these out is because M$ has demonstrated time and time again (How much did the EU fine them again?) that they aren’t really putting the needs of their users up front.  Then again they are not really putting their engineering on the top of the heap either; most of their technology is “inspired” (stolen from) by Apple and various UNIX distributions.  

M$ wants your cash and wants to influence the industry in to a scary sort of uniformity = “double, plus good”… “War is Peace; Freedom Is Slavery”… etc…

Honestly, I may not be the best person to comment on Windows for the home user as along time ago I decided I would rather not “buy a ticket on the Titanic” as it where… I own a PC… along with my Mac and UNIX systems.  All told I think folks should get beyond M$ and try being “multi-lingual OS” citizens of the Internet.  If we raise the bar for ourselves then M$ will too … when it becomes in their best interest  

NOTE: This post is more my two cents and less facts/figures then the last big one…all options are my own and for all I know could be compete horse hocky…  ;)
« Last Edit: April 05, 2004, 11:00:46 AM by etgadsby »
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Offline dew7

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Re:PCs
« Reply #79 on: April 05, 2004, 03:22:26 PM »
   Yes, user expertise is a must.  Users must know about firewalls, antivirus programs, anti-spyware programs to keep themselves safe on the Internet.  They must have enough knowledge to do things themselves and not rely on Microsoft for everything.  For instance, I learned that a security exploit did not only affect the NT source code but also was a weakness in the 9x code.  I called Microsoft and got patch 828028 to address this security issue.  I also got the hotfix for 2.1 gigahertz and faster processors on 98SE because I plan on upgrading my 450 mhz PIII when I have the money saved up but I do not want to switch to Windows XP Pro. until I have to due to security or other critical issues.  I have been writing to Microsoft to show my support of the 9x source and I can only hope and pray that it makes a difference.  I may evenutually have to go the Linux or Apple route but I will not do that until my hand is forced.  Right now, I am happy with the knowledge that 98SE is supported minimually through Windows Update until June 2006 but for many issues you must contact Microsoft for a majority of your support.   :D
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