Delling's Thread

[Deloria]

Which flavour did you use?

[Delling]

I had all these epic ideas of adding cocoa maybe--live dangerously!--some vanilla... I ended up doing plain sugar. But one of these days... chocolate whipped cream!

(Posted on: June 19, 2011, 12:24:14 PM)

I'll just leave this here... *walks away innocently* 

Warning: this topic has not been posted in for at least 180 days.
Unless you're sure you want to reply, please consider starting a new topic.

Oy, I 'ear ya but it's MY thread!! *dusts off thread*

_____

So, recently in a different thread on the forum, there was a brief exchange about bisexuality, and I was going to chime in, and then I didn't, and then Rosella chimed in, and Deloria followed suit, and again I felt like I really should respond too. (Melville, eat your heart out.) So, I started to respond and the response just flowed. But, it flowed kind of torrentially and deluge-like so that when I felt I was done, I realized that what I had written was a major overreaction to the content of the actual exchange.

So, I opted to just email it to Deloria instead. ...she however felt I should still post it. Since the post is very personal and since if people wanted to ask more questions or discuss certain points of the post I'd rather that were done in this thread or by PM, I figure posting it here is better.

_____

To answer Ms. Deloria

Spoiler (mouse over to reveal):

She's bi and simply put its a turn off. Most bi folk I have known since high school tend to be way too under-sexed to stay faithful in a relationship. I have been cheated on enough.... But I suppose you could say I have  presumptively assume between the pot and bi-ness, her dropping out school and general gut feeling....that she is not in my best interest.

Yikes. I don't want to start a flame war here, but that sort of made me a bit sick to my stomach.

Spoiler (mouse over to reveal):

Being bisexual doesn't mean you can't get enough so you'll do it with anyone. I mean, to be perfectly honest, if a girl really wants to put herself out there, there are usually enough guys interested. But honestly, with people who are genuinely into both sexes, it's a lot like being into both brunettes and blondes. You like both, but you don't feel like, when you're with a blonde, "Man, I need some brunette lovin' on the side to keep me satisfied." I understand if you didn't think she was your type (the choices she's made seem sketchy at best), but being bisexual and having a high sex drive aren't necessarily related and honestly, neither is having a high sex drive and cheating. Bisexuality isn't a choice that people with loose morals make to get more, it's a sexual orientation.

Rosella

also Deloria

I feel like I should do this outside of spoiler-tags.

I have to thank Rosella for weighing in on this because I am bi and earlier didn't do it myself because I'm not out on the forum. (Mostly because the LGBT community seems to think that this magical thing happens when you COME OUT... but it really doesn't... you're going to meet a lot of people after that in your life and most of the time, most of us aren't going to be wearing a badge... ...also... fair warning to any heteronormative homophobes: we don't wear badges! le gasp, etc.)

So, yeah, I'm bi, and I've had to deal with counselors and therapists telling me "oh, you're just indecisive" and "you haven't really settled or accepted that yet" and in one particular case, I've dealt with the assertion that as a guy who is into guys, I will be prone to frequent and random sexual encounters, because I can because the consequences are lessened because we're guys. Seriously... you went to college to get a degree to help people and all you got is this run-of-the-mill pedestrian claptrap!! (which isn't even to get into the familial side of things... the less said about that, the better)

I was also raised Christian and I still identify with Christianity and as a Christian and I still have pretty much all of those morals intact: my God!!--it's as if liking members of the same gender does not immediately strip you of all sense of sexual and moral proportion and turn you into a sex addict!! Alert the presses!! ...oh... they know... are you sure? Oh... so it's just the South then... okay. (This is overselling it.)

I have only had 1--that's ONE, uno, une, unus, una, unum, heis, mia, hen, aon, 一个--relationship that went beyond even kissing... in fact, it's also pretty much the only relationship that went as far as kissing. It was awful and the guy was terrible (in oh so many more ways than one). And I had to put up with all the "you're undecided", "you're really gay; you just don't know it yet" BS from him too... alongside a bunch of other terrible and hurtful crap. And when he broke up with me, he tried his damnedest to push me into running around and gaining some "sexual experience" --to the extent that the first conversation we had post-break up was his googling a gay bar in Atlanta and giving me the address more or less with the implication being "go get laid and get over me".

Spoiler (mouse over to reveal):

I s*** you not.
...
Also... and I hope this isn't a spoiler: but read between the lines a little--I didn't do anything of the sort!!

So, I understand that you are speaking from your own experience, ladidada, but please add this to your experiences: all bisexuals are not promiscuous cheaters who are going to run around on you, can't commit, and won't respect the boundaries of your relationship (不，那为了废人在这个世界). It is just as unfair for you to paint all of us with that brush as it would be for me to consider all Christians as bigoted and backwards fools who just scapegoat on the sins of the clobber passages because it's easier than dealing with their own inveterate sins. (Uhm... I'm saying that I don't do that and that one should do neither... I am NOT, repeat NOT, attacking Christians... 'twould be silly... I am one )

While we're at it, you may include: "bisexuals exist" and "not all Christians are heterosexuals". (That these have to be pointed out to ridiculously high numbers of people is both telling and scary.)

And to be fair to you, ladidada, her drug issues and education issues (which to me generally signals self-esteem problems as well) would have made her unattractive to me too.


dang... if only I could get this much writing done for my litreview.

_____

feu... back to work...

[darthkiwi]

This post has so much win! I was going to point out moments where I couldn't help chuckling at your wit or applauding your level-headedness, but there are just too many.

And it's always frustrating and demeaning when somebody says "You're just undecided" or some other variation of "Yes, I definitely know exactly what's going on inside your head! Better than you do! You disagree? But then you'd be *wrong*!"

Oh, and kudos for not going to the gay bar. Not because gay bars are bad, of course (they're not) but because that sounds like another massive instance of this "I know you better than you do" cr**.

[Rosella]

I find that a lot of problems with being bi come from getting judged from both the straight and the gay communities. The straight community thinks you're either lying to get attention or just horrible for being into the same sex (*gasp*) and the gay community thinks you're trying to keep one foot in the closet to remain socially acceptable (like that helps) or that you're really going to end up as one of those "breeders" eventually, so you're just fooling around with the same sex.

My ex came out to me a bit ago and I was kind of homophobic at the time, not in the heterosexist way of "Gay people are wrong," but just in the weirded out way of "two guys kissing seems oogie." He naturally found this very amusing and exploited it at every turn, leading to overexposure and now I'm fine with it (though still not turned on by it as some people expect me to be...?).

My first reaction was primarily one of discomfort in being afraid he'd be gay (Again, not because being gay is wrong, but because it doesn't say good things about the health of his relationship with me), but the more he explained it to me, the more it made sense. If you like two things, you're not going to suddenly decide somehow that you're not into one. Arbitrarily closing a door doesn't really make any sense. It's terrible, Delling, that actual trained counselors don't understand that. Especially since in this generally monosexual society I find most people think they're bi as a last option. (Wait, I'm into dudes. I guess I'm gay? Wait, no, I swear I still like chicks. Maybe I'm straight. Wait. I can be into both?)

And I LOVE that assertion that homo-/bisexual guys (with no women to hold them back, because, as you know, women never want sex) are just writhing piles of sex all the time, with no concern for anything, in front of children, in their job. Nothing can stop them.

And I think the big deal with coming out is that usually when you come out to one person, it makes it easier to come out to others. My ex explicitly came out to all of his friends at the time and in college he won't refrain from making comments about the attractiveness of guys, but like you said, he doesn't exactly wear a badge.

I'm glad you felt comfortable enough to post this, and it was great to know your story. It's seems pretty clear that you're at a point now where you're comfortable with who you are and don't need outside reassurance, but for what it's worth, I've been there (from a different perspective, being straight, but still). You can find reassurance here.

[Haids1987]

I'm glad you felt comfortable enough to post this, and it was great to know your story. It's seems pretty clear that you're at a point now where you're comfortable with who you are and don't need outside reassurance, but for what it's worth, I've been there (from a different perspective, being straight, but still). You can find reassurance here.

Basically what I was going to say, but Kelsey said it so much better.

I'm sorry that you've been twisted around by so many people telling you that what you feel isn't "real" or "normal," Delling. What a pain! And you know, I'm sooooooo glad that you pointed out that being gay or bi doesn't make a sex-crazed perv. I get so tired of the stereotype that, because someone is bi or homosexual, they immediately don't have the same morals as straight people. What difference should it make?

In any case, people are people and we need to respect one another regardless of what we believe. I've always liked you, Delling, but now I respect you even more for not only being brave enough to talk to us about it, but also to stand up for what you believe in and be kind, mature, and well-versed. You're awesome!

[writerlove]

I'm glad you felt comfortable to tell us this , Delling Thank you for being honest and sharing with us. I'm straight but don't judge if someone is bi/gay/q****/etc. To me, Love is love and it should be accepted in all forms. We can't help who we love and it shouldn't matter.

as it would be for me to consider all Christians as bigoted and backwards fools who just scapegoat on the sins of the clobber passages because it's easier than dealing with their own inveterate sins. (Uhm... I'm saying that I don't do that and that one should do neither... I am NOT, repeat NOT, attacking Christians... 'twould be silly... I am one

I totally agree with you here. There's this huge stereotype that Christians hate gay people. That is not true. It's the loud mouth bigots who make the rest of us look bad. *sigh* Treat me with respect and I will do the same for you. Simple as that.

[KatieHal]

I just want to offer support and props to you folks for being comfortable and certain in who you are, not giving in to others' labels, and being so supportive of each other as well. This is why our forum is awesome.

[Delling]

Aww... thank you, Haids and writerlover!

You give me hope that there are good Christians out there.

Rosella!

That sounds rough, but it also sounds like you grew a lot from it.

Especially since in this generally monosexual society I find most people think they're bi as a last option. (Wait, I'm into dudes. I guess I'm gay? Wait, no, I swear I still like chicks. Maybe I'm straight. Wait. I can be into both?)

Yeah, there was a time in my life, a dark time, a scary time in a bad place--a time we shall call... HIGH SCHOOL!! DUN DUN DUN Wherein all of these supposedly Christian people were divided into two groups: the ones who were actively calling me "gay" (and they weren't that nice about it...) to my face, making lurid suggestions, and all of this other stuff, and the ones especially the authority figures who weren't doing anything about it whether they agreed with it or not (I lost all respect for my history teacher when he sat there one study hall, watched them saying these things to me, and then afterward, having said nothing to them, told me "just don't let it get to you" ).

Prior to high school, I'd only ever been really interested in girls (I think I had noticed guys before but never really dwelt on it), and in the midst of all of this, I did find that I had some attraction to guys... I definitely spent many of those years doing the "am I? amn't I?" dance (where the adjective after either of those could be "gay" or "straight"). Then, sometime towards the end of college when I didn't have to care so much about the definitions of others any more (because it wasn't a daily conflict any more), I took a step back, looked at my actual feelings, and just said "look, basically, you like girls, you like guys, you're bi: deal with it and let's move on".

And Katie, this forum is awesome.  

[GrahamRocks!]

It could have been a lot worse, Delling. You could have been a sheltered person who never interacts with anyone (internet wise or physically wise)

[Haids1987]

You give me hope that there are good Christians out there.

We've talked about your history in the church, and it breaks my heart that there are people near you who make it seem unauthentic. A true person of faith (any kind of faith, Christ-centered or not) loves and accepts all people.  I'm sorry that those around you who call themselves Christians and judge have given a bad name to those of us who actually try to follow the Word.

(I lost all respect for my history teacher when he sat there one study hall, watched them saying these things to me, and then afterward, having said nothing to them, told me "just don't let it get to you" ).

That (wo)man should have never been given a teaching certificate. Especially now, when schools are supposed to be so bully-conscious and be raising kids up instead of the opposite.

[Delling]

It could have been a lot worse, Delling. You could have been a sheltered person who never interacts with anyone (internet wise or physically wise)

Oh, I am pretty bad at interacting with people in person for various reasons that weave in and out of this issue.

(I lost all respect for my history teacher when he sat there one study hall, watched them saying these things to me, and then afterward, having said nothing to them, told me "just don't let it get to you" ).

That (wo)man should have never been given a teaching certificate. Especially now, when schools are supposed to be so bully-conscious and be raising kids up instead of the opposite.

yeah, it was a private Christian school and I'm pretty sure he'd been teaching since before the 90's push to have all teachers certified. (Scary thought, huh?) Private schools tend to lag behind on standardization like that as well.

[Haids1987]

We should all band together and soap the windows of his car.  Then in lipstick we could write, "JUST DON'T LET IT GET TO YOU." I'd fly there for you, Delling!

On a completely unrelated topic, I had a random thought this morning and knew that you and/or Deloria would be the perfect people to ask: so I'm going to this memorial tomorrow, and I was thinking about the word eulogy. It sounds ridiculously Greek, and got me wondering where its roots lie. Tell me, o wise one, where did it come from?

[Delling]

As for my history teacher, I'm over it.

Now, then, you have asked a question that's right up my alley (and part of the original purpose of this thread (as I said back on like page 1 )):

So, eulogy: Firstly, your intuition that it is Greek is correct. It has two of the big hallmarks of Greek-English borrowings/coinings: eu- which means "well" and -ology/-logy- which we see crop up all over the place to mean essentially "the study of...". In this case, however, -logy is serving closer to its original Greek λόγια- the act of speaking, from the o-grade noun λόγος + abstraction suffix -ια from the e-grade verb λέγω- I speak. Hence, ευλογία is "the act of speaking well" or "the act of speaking well of..." as this is ideally what we do when we give a eulogy: we speak well of the dead.

[Haids1987]

See, I knew you'd be the person to ask. Thanks, Delling. That's a good thing to remember tomorrow when I'm listening to people "speak well of" her.

[Deloria]

Most etymologies are more interesting because their stems are hidden or have changed drastically over the years through passing through multiple languages and evolving in those. That one's fairly direct/simple because it was borrowed into Latin and then directly into English.

[darthkiwi]

I got the "logos" bit!!!! Studying Greek tragedies DOES have a purpose!

Oh dear, now I have to go and study Greek tragedies again. Fascinating but tiring.

[Haids1987]

Oh dear, now I have to go and study Greek tragedies again. Fascinating but tiring.

But they're usually worth it! Exhausting, yes. I agree completely!

[DawsonJ]

Eu- of Eulogy is the same as the positive meanings in the words Euphoria, Euphemism, and Euthanasia. Correct?

[Delling]

Yes, indeed. Its opposite is generally dys-.

[snabbott]

Eu- of Eulogy is the same as the positive meanings in the words Euphoria, Euphemism, and Euthanasia. Correct?

Not to mention Eukaryote.