As I've said here and elsewhere many times, I've been addicted to and in love with King's Quest since I was just 5 years old--in 1995. I've never given up on the series despite tons of setbacks, and I still love the realm of Daventry and it's Royal Family. I recognize there are many "superior" fantasy worlds out there, both in video games and in print, but none have ever captured my imagination the way the World of King's Quest did and still does.
For whatever reason, I also have retained a big emotional investment in the series, as strong as it was when I first fell in love with the series--In that I passionately just want to have it done right, to either see it begin again, or at least see a truly fulfilling end to it. We never did truly get an "end", or even a fulfilling continuation on par with KQ5 and KQ6--and I believe such a continuation is possible. I threw in my lots with TT and defended it strongly because I saw it as the only viable possibility for KQ to live again...And I was wrong in doing so. They were indeed the wrong company to go to.
I now only really trust the various fan groups--but they appear to be interested more in their own original work, which is understandable. I don't think, though, that I'll ever give up on King's Quest, and I don't even know why. The world it depicts, the characters, their adventures and struggles, the lands of the game, the art, the music, still enrapture me. Even my girlfriend, who DESPISES all things fantasy, was enthralled by the art and music of King's Quest V. I played her the Desert Oasis music and other songs from KQ5 and KQ6 and she thought much of it was incredibly beautiful.
That special combination of atmosphere, beauty, magic, and wondrous lands and characters, which constituted King's Quest has never been truly recaptured in any other game series or fantasy book I've tried...And I have tried to find one which matches the standard.
KQ captured me so, so long ago, when I was young of heart and mind, and I suppose I simply can't let go...
...Is this a rhetorical question? :P
Have you played The Silver Lining, Sir Perceval? Sounds like you would love it.
Quote from: GrahamRocks! on January 13, 2013, 03:49:24 PM
Have you played The Silver Lining, Sir Perceval? Sounds like you would love it.
I did yes...At one time, I hated it, I was totally against it. I was as bitter toward it as SW fans are against the prequels. Nowadays, I actually kind of like it. It's not the direction I myself would've taken KQ if I could, or what I feel is the ideal direction, but it is a good and worthy attempt. I wish I'd been much less critical and more open minded toward the game earlier on, actually. At this point, as I said, I trust only the fans to carry forth KQ, and I feel like any fan interpretation of KQ is equally valid as any other.
I'll take that as a yes.
Quote from: GrahamRocks! on January 13, 2013, 03:49:24 PM
Have you played The Silver Lining, Sir Perceval? Sounds like you would love it.
:suffer:
Quote from: Sir Perceval of Daventry on January 13, 2013, 04:01:19 PM
Quote from: GrahamRocks! on January 13, 2013, 03:49:24 PM
Have you played The Silver Lining, Sir Perceval? Sounds like you would love it.
I did yes...At one time, I hated it, I was totally against it. I was as bitter toward it as SW fans are against the prequels. Nowadays, I actually kind of like it. It's not the direction I myself would've taken KQ if I could, or what I feel is the ideal direction, but it is a good and worthy attempt. I wish I'd been much less critical and more open minded toward the game earlier on, actually. At this point, as I said, I trust only the fans to carry forth KQ, and I feel like any fan interpretation of KQ is equally valid as any other.
Honestly I understand how you feel. There are many parts of the Silver Lining that I had to completely block out to enjoy it.
Alexander's hair and personality, everyone's complete and uttar apathy, soo many people acted completely or oddly out of character for the convenience of the plot.
which is exactly what this sort of game shouldn't do... and the creators don't justify this well. They bend the plot and characters in order to make Graham the hero much more easily. Yet the reason that doesn't work is that they didn't need to. Everyone could have been competent, skilled, and active while at the same time not taking anything away from Graham. By making Graham the exclusive person trying to do anything it takes me out of the fact that this is a story and puts it into the realm of being a game. Which is why their excuse is not only flimsy but it shows how far they gone to convince themselves that it was the right thing to do.
As well because they don't help it makes it harder to really see the full scope of their adventures and the people they met and the friendships they earned. When your mother in law won't get on her flying Swan to ask her next door neighbours some questions... You know there is something wrong.
It is honestly the absolute worst aspect of the game's storytelling and what is, to me at least, what is keeping the game back from being perfect.
Though what I liked the most about it was that for a game that was meant to "end everything" it fit soo much continuity it hurt! which is great because that is EXACTLY what I wanted it to do.
In fact that is the best part of the story. This is a game that does feel like it is leading up to the final conclusion bridging every game every character and every villain and hero into one single point.
***
What the game does right: The Villains! Honestly top notch work on the villains themselves. They are villainous, dark, and powerful and make you feel the sheer scope of their power almost constantly as you wonder if you can really succeed. In fact they would be even cooler if it wasn't for...
What the game does wrong: The Other Characters. The number of well done characters in this game absolutely full of characters can be counted on one maybe two hands. Why arn't the villains any cooler? Because no one really cares. What should be an international crisis involving several kingdoms felt more like an everyday occurance.
Honestly Cassima seemed to channel what everyone was thinking when she told them Graham will have this problem sorted before breakfast.
What is also does right: Graham... Honestly Graham, appart from a few canonical hiccups, was done flawlessly and I cannot think of him anyother way. You know he could just throw the fact that he is a king around to get what he wants but choses not to because he is such a great guy. Which is what helps you like Graham you want him to succeed. Those Jerks at the castle, except that FREEKISHLY helpful Genie, won't do it so you will have to go in alone.
Quote from: Lambonius on January 13, 2013, 09:58:48 PM
Quote from: GrahamRocks! on January 13, 2013, 03:49:24 PM
Have you played The Silver Lining, Sir Perceval? Sounds like you would love it.
:suffer:
XD bwahahahahaha :rofl: sorry... just too much XD
Quote from: Sir Perceval of Daventry on January 13, 2013, 04:01:19 PM
Quote from: GrahamRocks! on January 13, 2013, 03:49:24 PM
Have you played The Silver Lining, Sir Perceval? Sounds like you would love it.
I did yes...At one time, I hated it, I was totally against it. I was as bitter toward it as SW fans are against the prequels. Nowadays, I actually kind of like it.
:o :o :o :o :o :o
*faints*
*reads Neo's post* Well Katie? Are you going to say anything to defend against that?
Now me, I frankly am happy with what we have so far. In fact, as you might have noticed by this post in the "What Are You Doing? Thread":
QuoteJust finished re-reading the "Theories on what is to come!" thread, and... to be honest I probably shouldn't have done that (haha BEN reference whatever) because it makes me anxious.
Especially Damar's Theories. Dang it, Damar! I don't WANT Graham to sacrifice himself! He deserves to live out his days in peace, with his family by his side, not as an eternal guardian where he can never be with them again!
POS! Release episode 5 soon, PLEASE! The suspense is killing me!!!
that I'm getting downright anxious for it to come now that that it's 2013. The decade of planning this game has all come down to this... here's hoping you guys won't disappoint us like Bioware did with Mass Effect 3 (even though, personally I didn't think the Extended Cut endings were all that bad. I like green the best!), or *shudder* god forbid, EA did with Ultima 9: Ascension.
We've heard & responded to similar feedback before - the story execution isn't perfect, and we know that. Most of it was written years ago, and some of it we would do differently if we were writing it now.
Yes, we took some liberties, some new twists, some people really like them, some people not so much. As has been said, it IS ultimately fanfiction and it isn't canon, so you can take it as seriously as you want to (or not). One lesson I've learned well is that you can't please all the people all the time.
That said, we still really enjoy and support the story and character decisions that we went with! :) I really like it, to me it feels Kings Quest-y and I'm excited for when the final episode is done and released and everyone knows how our story ends. :)
Overall, I'm extremely proud of the work we've done, how far we've come. I'm proud that we went for something new in the fangame realm--not a remake or a reboot of a previous game, but a completely new story, a completely 3D world, new music, voices, locations, as well as new touches and twists on old, familiar faces and places.
Which, in getting back to the original intent of this thread, is why I still love King's Quest. I love the old stories and games, and I love that I can still get something new out of it. I love the special, irreplaceable place it has in my life and my journey, that I can trace from my youth to this very day and into my future. King's Quest for me is timeless, nostalgic, personal, and universal. And that's why I love it.
Even I, one who didn't even know what King's Quest was until late 2011, agree on that! Katie just said what I wanted to say anyway.
Don't kid yourself, GrahamRocks! If the people at AGDI and IA are to be believed, then TSL is the laughingstock of the entire King's Quest series. Don't take it from me, take it from Lambonius. It takes almost a decade for TSL to come out, and when it finally does get released, everyone treats it like crap. It's really kind of disheartening.
So to end this post on a lighter note, I want to write a script for TSL where everyone talks like real people.
*after Shadrack zaps Rosella in the opening scene*
Graham: S**T! Dammit, Rosie, WAKE UP! Oh God, what the f**k WAS that thing?!
Just watch though- when episode 5 is released, it'll blow those opinions of it being the laughingstock of KQ Fandom right out of the water!
I'm trying to be more positive these days. Sue me.
That's not all that true. Not everyone treats it like crap. TSL has a big following, and if anything it's divisive among the fans that take KQ's rules too seriously. Not only from the press itself that have called things like "impressive" and "touching", but we continue to receive, time and time again, countless of comments and letters of how people love the TSL saga. I've gotten pictures of parents playing TSL with their kids, people with terminal illness that has told me that TSL have given them so much joy and that they love every minute of it, etc, etc
There's obviously an audience among us that loves it to pieces, and we are here because of them. That's the people that we continue to make the games for, people like us, that can enjoy the game immensely.
To me Katie really doesn't need to defend anything from what I wrote. All it means in the grand scheme is that it isn't perfect.
In fact oddly enough Katie didn't.
Also I didn't know The Silver Lining was disliked. I mean I brought up some flaws but honestly I didn't think they detracted from the game's good point.
I mean don't confuse the length of my rants the reason I can talk about what I didn't like for longer is because more can be said without needing to go in depth. Heck it is easy to forget the game has any flaws when you are watching scenes like Graham talking to the sleeping Valanece or honestly just Graham.
DANG Graham is perfect in this.
I know, right?! I think it's partially due to the writing, and partially due to to Jason Michael Victor's AWESOME voice for Graham! It's just how I'd imagine he'd sound.
To me the definitive point where it just felt like Graham was when he was dealing with the painter
you just KNOW that any ordinary King would have went "Look, I am a king... just do what I want and I'll give you tons of money"
I wouldn't say TSL is regarded as a laughingstock; there are just a number of very vocal critics. It's kind of impressive to me that a lot of the reviews judge it by commercial game standards.
Really? *cocks head* How so? All the stuff I've found (mainly the stuff on King's Quest Omnipedia, which SOMEBODY NEEDS TO UPDATE ONE OF THESE DAYS!) has been either "okay" or "not good".
Well, it's more the graphics, animation, and music. Of those, only the music is consistently praised. (Because Austin is amazing! :D)
I guess I just pay more attention to detractors. It stems from the fact that I'm very pessimistic, both online and in real life.
I'm hoping against hope that when episode 5 is released, that it'll be the best saved for last (action scenes FTW).
And I will say this: if you don't like the soundtrack in TSL, you need your head checked.
Hey, no no no, I don't think The Silver Lining is "The Laughingstock of the King's Quest Community". That's reserved for Kings Quest 2¼: Breast Intentions.
Some people really love TSL, other's don't care for it as much - but there's no denying that it's a major accomplishment and a major effort - a major FRESHMAN effort from a tea who has not only managed to make it, but move on to making their own games, and working with respected veterans in the industry like Jane Jensen.
I may have teased Cez and Katie about minute details in the past, but there's no denying their drive, talent and passion - and TSL is just the tip of the iceberg at all of that.
Bt
LOL, well good to know we at least rank above that game :P
And thank you, Bt and back at you guys! :)
Yeah, I didn't address that, but like BT said, whatever rivalries that may have arisen in the past among our groups is all gone. We are good sports now, and can enjoy the healthy banter. We're way past that, and we do our best to support one another.
Quote from: Cez on January 14, 2013, 09:43:38 PM
Yeah, I didn't address that, but like BT said, whatever rivalries that may have arisen in the past among our groups is all gone. We are good sports now, and can enjoy the healthy banter. We're way past that, and we do our best to support one another.
It IS fun to poke the dead horse every once in a while though. ;)
(http://i158.photobucket.com/albums/t97/Lambonius/peekaboo_avatar.png)
Plus, y'know, whenever Lamb & I inevitably cross paths in person at long last, I'll find a way to sneak in a smack upside the head. Just 'cause. :)
(semi-related, are any of you guys going to PAX East?)
Quote from: GrahamRocks! on January 14, 2013, 06:15:21 PM
Really? *cocks head* How so? All the stuff I've found (mainly the stuff on King's Quest Omnipedia, which SOMEBODY NEEDS TO UPDATE ONE OF THESE DAYS!) has been either "okay" or "not good".
Given that the admin of the Wiki is banned from these forums, largely because of his insistence on nitpicking the tiniest details of TSL that were "incorrect", I don't think you're looking at the most unbiased of sources there. :P
Quote from: Blackthorne on January 14, 2013, 07:25:53 PM
Hey, no no no, I don't think The Silver Lining is "The Laughingstock of the King's Quest Community". That's reserved for Kings Quest 2¼: Breast Intentions.
Heh. Don't forget about Owl's Quest.
Quote from: crayauchtin on January 15, 2013, 01:32:08 PM
Quote from: GrahamRocks! on January 14, 2013, 06:15:21 PM
Really? *cocks head* How so? All the stuff I've found (mainly the stuff on King's Quest Omnipedia, which SOMEBODY NEEDS TO UPDATE ONE OF THESE DAYS!) has been either "okay" or "not good".
Given that the admin of the Wiki is banned from these forums, largely because of his insistence on nitpicking the tiniest details of TSL that were "incorrect", I don't think you're looking at the most unbiased of sources there. :P
If you ever have a half hour to waste, check out this page:
http://kingsquest.wikia.com/wiki/TSL_universe
The amount of pedantic nitpicking this guy does is either hilarious or scary. Think I'm going to go with scary. And the best part is that the extremely long article is STILL marked as being a stub.
Ooo, I hadn't seen the whole section on Derek yet! *makes popcorn*
y'know, skimming over the article, they did bring up a good point about Hassan. In fact, when I watched Dilandau's LP of KQ6, I actually said out loud, "Hassan!! You were such a nice guy back then! What happened to you between King's Quest 6 and The Silver Lining?!"
But, I've just been chalking it up to he's gotten greedy over the years, now that he's back in business and that whole "My business is hanging by a thread as it is! I've got my crew to support, myself to support..." was just so Graham would back down and leave him alone. Since, well, according to TH&GS, Hassan doesn't like Graham very much (even if it is hilarious!)
As for the tower... I thought the same thing as the article (that you took creative license again). That is, until I started watching Dilandau3000's LPs (starting with King's Quest 1), and I saw THIS!:
Hmmm... the archetecture of the tower here looks very familiar, doesn't it? Could it be that that point about the tower looking different was wrong and you were just subtly hinting at the manual/Companion? Or perhaps this young lady is a naive little lass who doesn't know what she's talking about?
Could we get the thread back on track please?
I don't know about PAX East yet, Katie. Going to find out more about that next week - I'll shoot ya a note.
Also, hey, thread police - people ARE talking about why they still love King's Quest. Don't get worried yet. When we start talking about whether or not Wookiees reproduce via asexual budding, then maybe a nudge back to Graham and the Fam is needed.
Bt
Bahahaha! XD
Awww....is Baggins really still banned? I think it's high time he was allowed back. I only ever get to read his wall-of-text posts over at Telltale now.
Did he get banned at the IA forums too?
Quote from: 929572 on January 19, 2013, 02:06:13 PM
Did he get banned at the IA forums too?
No, I don't believe he was ever banned there, though those forums are pretty dead of late. You can chat all of us up at Infamous Quests though. infamous-quests.com/forum (http://infamous-quests.com/forum)
Quote from: 929572 on January 15, 2013, 02:08:43 PM
If you ever have a half hour to waste, check out this page:
http://kingsquest.wikia.com/wiki/TSL_universe
The amount of pedantic nitpicking this guy does is either hilarious or scary. Think I'm going to go with scary. And the best part is that the extremely long article is STILL marked as being a stub.
This is the best thing I've read all day.
Quote"Hassan!! You were such a nice guy back then! What happened to you between King's Quest 6 and The Silver Lining?!"
I figured he didn't get Greedy at all and that giving away his buisness for free would destitute him rather quickly.
As well Graham was more then in a possition to either pay for it or even command him to do it.
I will say I am a bit surprised at where the companion and the game differ.
Hassan has been in a bad mood ever since someone stole his sailor's cap.
You know, I'm confused by this passage from the KQ Omnipedia:
Quote"In Kingdom of Sorrow, it describes Graham's favorite tunic (at least around 13 GC); blue cotton with silver piping and flowers embroidered in gray along the neck and waist.[2] He also wears a tunic, purple with gold piping and delicate leaves embroidered in gold thread along the neckline and a purple velvet belt. The gold buckle held a dark ruby in the center. On top of the tunic he wore a purple velvet cloak fastened at his neck with a gold catch.[3] To keep worm, he two pairs of woolen pants, and three pairs of cotton shirts. He put on several pairs of socks, and a well-worn leather boots. He put on a wool jerkin that was coarse, un-dyed, and most importantly thick. He cinched it around his waist with a leather belt, and belt knife in a sheaf attached to his belt. Then he put on a scarf, black wool mittens and a fur hat. He wore a wool outer cloak, dyed black with the royal sigil of Daventry (gyrfalcon embroidered in white and gold) on the back. The cloak had an inner pocket.[4]"
If this is true, then why in the world is that not his canon outfit instead? Also, I thought Daventry's symbol was a lion and a unicorn rearing in opposite directions with a 'D' in the middle?
...Because he never dressed like that in the games? :P
Some may disagree, but I don't really think the novels can be considered "canon".
Most people don't wear their favourite clothes to go out adventuring in. :P The ones you described may be his favourite *court* clothes. And, of course, he may have different wardrobes for different seasons or different climes.
There is a difference between heraldic symbols and coats of arms and a difference between both of those and the flag or standard. The coat of arms changes to the monarch's arms every time a new monarch ascends, whereas the symbol usually stays the same and is used on the standards.