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Writing Quality in TSL Feedback

Started by Rick_Florez, September 26, 2010, 11:52:34 AM

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kindofdoon

Which conversation are you referring to? The one with the cartographer?

Daniel Dichter, Production/PR
daniel.dichter@postudios.com

darthkiwi

I don't remember where exactly, but at one point the narrator says "have took", as in, "you have took the item."

Just... no. Please, no.
Prince of the Aquitaine. Duke of York.

Knight errant and consort to Her Grace the Empress Deloria of the Holy Roman Empire, Queene of all Albion and Princess Palatine.

kindofdoon

I would expect myself to catch such a glaring grammatical error, but I never did. Can you be more specific about its location?

Daniel Dichter, Production/PR
daniel.dichter@postudios.com

Deloria

Quote from: darthkiwi on September 29, 2010, 03:46:52 PM
I don't remember where exactly, but at one point the narrator says "have took", as in, "you have took the item."

Just... no. Please, no.
Indeed. :P That was very, very bad. :P
 
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Enchantermon

I'm also surprised that I didn't catch that; I would have visibly cringed.
So what if I am, huh? Anyways, I work better when I'm drunk. It makes me fearless! If I see a bad guy, I'll just point my sword at him and saaaaaaaaaay, "Hey! Bad guy! You're not s'posed to be here! Go home or I'll stick you with my sword 'til you go, 'Ouch! I'm dead!' Ah-ha-ha!" Ha-ha. *hic* See? Ain't no one gonna be messin' wit' ol', Benny!

kindofdoon

Yeah, same here. Therefore I can only conclude that I didn't hear that line in the first plane.

Daniel Dichter, Production/PR
daniel.dichter@postudios.com

Lambonius

Quote from: Deloria on September 29, 2010, 07:42:01 PM
Quote from: darthkiwi on September 29, 2010, 03:46:52 PM
I don't remember where exactly, but at one point the narrator says "have took", as in, "you have took the item."

Just... no. Please, no.
Indeed. :P That was very, very bad. :P

No, no.  You don't understand.  It was intentional.  It adds realism to the dialog.   ;)

Rosella

Now that's not fair. :P

I'm pretty sure what Cesar meant when he said that was like, people don't go around saying "What is the item of which you speak?" and it's much more likely to see "What are you talking about?" even though that sentence is grammatically frowned upon. Because of that, you're going to see more of the latter types of statements in TSL.

No intelligent person would say "have took." :P
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kindofdoon

I agree, it's unfair to equate grammatical errors of grossly differing magnitudes.

Daniel Dichter, Production/PR
daniel.dichter@postudios.com

Rosella

I'm sure Lambonius was just poking fun and didn't mean any harm, but still, it's not fair. :P
I'm a princess even if my kingdom is pixelated.

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KatieHal

Quote from: kindofdoon on September 29, 2010, 09:32:46 PM
I agree, it's unfair to equate grammatical errors of grossly differing magnitudes.

LOL, doon FTW!

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Lambonius

#31
Heh.  Yeah, I was just teasing.  To be fair though, the errors I was referring to in my initial review were more of the "have took" type and less of the "prose-vs.-vernacular" type.  I write humanities papers as part of my career--I know the difference.  ;)  I haven't had a chance yet to go back through the game and try to pick out specifics.  I plan on replaying both episodes this weekend to try and get a handle on what exactly it was that was bothering me about writing (and I'll keep my ears open about grammar, too--though I'm not going to go through it with a fine toothed comb or anything.  ;))

And actually, most of the characters in TSL DO talk like "What is the item of which you speak?"--more formal sounding English.  Which is what makes the incorrect parts stand out even more to my ears.  Again though, I can't really talk specifics til I replay this weekend.  Not to mention the fact that almost all the characters in the old KQ games spoke in formal English, too.  :)

kindofdoon

Quote from: Lambonius on September 29, 2010, 09:43:27 PM
And actually, most of the characters in TSL DO talk like "What is the item of which you speak?"--more formal sounding English.  Which is what makes the incorrect parts stand out even more to my ears.

I agree. I recall one specific line from Episode 1, where Hassan says "This ain't like nothing I've ever seen before." Now that line stuck out like...well, a lot. He speaks very formally, with no colloquialisms, and then he drops that one like a bomb.

Note: I am not citing this as grammatically incorrect English (though technically it is), but rather as awkward-sounding English in context.

Daniel Dichter, Production/PR
daniel.dichter@postudios.com

Lambonius

You raise a good point, doon.  It's not necessarily that some lines COULDN'T work--but it seems like there is a consistency issue in the dialog with many characters.  Hassan may not be the best example, given the plethora of salty sea-slang that we hear from him in Ep. 2, but there are others that go from very formal to very informal on a dime--which makes the informalities sound more awkward than they might otherwise sound if the character spoke that way all the time.

kindofdoon

Yes, exactly. Though I would assert that Hassan is still a good example. Though his salty sailor talk may be...well, salty, it's still grammatically correct and doesn't use any colloquialisms like "ain't" or any double negatives like "ain't like nothing", so it does blend with his more formal stuff. It's just that one line...

(Posted on: September 30, 2010, 12:03:35 AM)


The way I think of it is as follows. For dialog to be consistent, a character must stay within the language palette they define through their introductory dialogue. Hassan defines his language palette on the IoC docks, speaking formally and without colloquialisms. The issue presents itself on the IoM, when Hassan suddenly breaks from his language palette by saying "ain't like nothing" in a formal voice (very awkward).

It would be like me suddenly dropping an expletive in the middle of the post. You'd notice it immediately, because I don't curse, and thus it would seem unnatural.

Daniel Dichter, Production/PR
daniel.dichter@postudios.com

Lambonius

#35
Frankly, the main places I noticed awkward sounding lines were with the narrator.  Probably because she's supposed to be very formal most of the time.  There were one or two awkwardly worded lines from the sea nymphs that stuck out in my mind as well.  One that I seem to remember specifically was something like, "This is for that spell that you're searching for ingredients for."  Grammatically incorrect and awkwardly/redundantly worded, which was, of course, enhanced by the formal manner in which they spoke almost all of their other lines.

kindofdoon

The narrator is another can of worms entirely...

Yes, I agree.

Daniel Dichter, Production/PR
daniel.dichter@postudios.com

darthkiwi

Sorry, I'm not sure where the infamous "have took" thing happened and since I've just gone back to university I'm too busy to play through again :( I know it was the narrator who said it, though. I remember because I thought "They can't even use the 'It's ungrammatical but colloquial' argument for this one!"
Prince of the Aquitaine. Duke of York.

Knight errant and consort to Her Grace the Empress Deloria of the Holy Roman Empire, Queene of all Albion and Princess Palatine.

KatieHal

No, if that's in there, we definitely just missed one. I'm wondering which line it is now too.

Katie Hallahan
~Designer, PR Director~

"Change is the constant, the signal for rebirth, the egg of the phoenix." Christina Baldwin

I have a blog!

Haids1987

Quote from: Rosella on September 29, 2010, 09:25:47 PM
No intelligent person would say "have took." :P
Shakespeare did.

Romeo and Juliet, Scene V:

JULIET
Then have my lips the sin that they have took.


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