Author Topic: Spikey Hair & Held Hands  (Read 37015 times)

Offline Enchantermon

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Re: Spikey Hair & Held Hands
« Reply #20 on: March 05, 2011, 05:02:32 PM »
Why are you so obstinate in seeing holes in a plot you have no idea how it concludes?
Was that directed at me? Because I'm not being obstinate...I just said that I was confused, but I didn't bring it up because the story's not over yet.
So what if I am, huh? Anyways, I work better when I'm drunk. It makes me fearless! If I see a bad guy, I'll just point my sword at him and saaaaaaaaaay, "Hey! Bad guy! You're not s'posed to be here! Go home or I'll stick you with my sword 'til you go, 'Ouch! I'm dead!' Ah-ha-ha!" Ha-ha. *hic* See? Ain't no one gonna be messin' wit' ol', Benny!

Offline Cez

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Re: Spikey Hair & Held Hands
« Reply #21 on: March 05, 2011, 05:07:48 PM »
Why are you so obstinate in seeing holes in a plot you have no idea how it concludes?
Was that directed at me? Because I'm not being obstinate...I just said that I was confused, but I didn't bring it up because the story's not over yet.

No, man, that wasn't directed at you. It was directed at the OP, who has a habit of doing this. You are totally cool and reasonable.
« Last Edit: March 05, 2011, 05:09:31 PM by Cez »


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Offline Lambonius

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Re: Spikey Hair & Held Hands
« Reply #22 on: March 05, 2011, 05:13:00 PM »
This thread amuses me.

Offline Enchantermon

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Re: Spikey Hair & Held Hands
« Reply #23 on: March 05, 2011, 05:25:01 PM »
No, man, that wasn't directed at you.
Okay, just making sure. Thanks. :)
So what if I am, huh? Anyways, I work better when I'm drunk. It makes me fearless! If I see a bad guy, I'll just point my sword at him and saaaaaaaaaay, "Hey! Bad guy! You're not s'posed to be here! Go home or I'll stick you with my sword 'til you go, 'Ouch! I'm dead!' Ah-ha-ha!" Ha-ha. *hic* See? Ain't no one gonna be messin' wit' ol', Benny!

Offline Arkillian

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Re: Spikey Hair & Held Hands
« Reply #24 on: March 05, 2011, 05:27:24 PM »
Haters gonna hate. Seriously dude- wait till the end of the game. You have a lot of valid points, but stories have to have a certain amount of flow to them or it becomes too much information at once. The information seems too much right now cause they've actually given us A LOT of new information in the last 3 episodes. I got a bit stary eyed at the end of part 3 too, but right now, they've thrown us a curve ball. We haven't caught it yet. I've found playing games like this which have complex story lines (and fanatsy usually have complex storylines) that as long as it makes sense in the end that it can make the ending more dynamic, cause it's not just a 'Graham is going to save his family by doing the Mc Gyver thing'. Having new revelations about personalities can give us new appreciation for characters, rather than us taking their original personalities for granted.
Spoiler (mouse over to reveal):


Offline Cez

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Re: Spikey Hair & Held Hands
« Reply #25 on: March 05, 2011, 07:07:25 PM »

*= When I say YOU, I mean you, Cesar Bittar. None of my points, past or present, refer to Katie; I tend to think she would've written a great KQ game on her own if her Lieutenant character is anything to go by.

Actually, I designed that particular puzzle and wrote most of those lines. So, thank you.

As for the rest of the email, I'm never going to give you the answers you want to hear. If I pointed plot holes in other King's Quest games is because we've already seen them and we are supposed to be fixing them. If I can't give you a straight answer it is because I'm not going to spoil the plot that thousands of others are enjoying just to please you.

But you want a straight answer for example on the spikey hair? Ok, I'll give you one. We don't have the time for those details. Changing the spikey hair in Alexander means that we have to alter the model, and rebind him. When there are many things that need attention, that becomes a detail that you don't have the luxury of time for. I wasn't joking with, for example, KQ6. They could have just darkened the sprites so that it looked like Alexander got wet, just like they do in Uncharted.  Just because it was VGA, it doesn't mean it couldn't be done. The reason why it wasn't done wasn't the resolution, but because those are details that cost a lot of money to produce.

But when someone poses such questions with such obvious malicious intentions, I can't take them seriously. What completely baffles me is that if you dislike the game so much, why are you so obsessed about it?

I'm sorry that TSL ruined your life. But seriously man, go and play other things that you can really enjoy. Why the masochism?


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Re: Spikey Hair & Held Hands
« Reply #26 on: March 05, 2011, 07:18:33 PM »

*= When I say YOU, I mean you, Cesar Bittar. None of my points, past or present, refer to Katie; I tend to think she would've written a great KQ game on her own if her Lieutenant character is anything to go by.

Actually, I designed that particular puzzle and wrote most of those lines. So, thank you.

As for the rest of the email, I'm never going to give you the answers you want to hear. If I pointed plot holes in other King's Quest games is because we've already seen them and we are supposed to be fixing them. If I can't give you a straight answer it is because I'm not going to spoil the plot that thousands of others are enjoying just to please you.

But you want a straight answer for example on the spikey hair? Ok, I'll give you one. We don't have the time for those details. Changing the spikey hair in Alexander means that we have to alter the model, and rebind him. When there are many things that need attention, that becomes a detail that you don't have the luxury of time for. I wasn't joking with, for example, KQ6. They could have just darkened the sprites so that it looked like Alexander got wet, just like they do in Uncharted.  Just because it was VGA, it doesn't mean it couldn't be done. The reason why it wasn't done wasn't the resolution, but because those are details that cost a lot of money to produce.

But when someone poses such questions with such obvious malicious intentions, I can't take them seriously. What completely baffles me is that if you dislike the game so much, why are you so obsessed about it?

I'm sorry that TSL ruined your life. But seriously man, go and play other things that you can really enjoy. Why the masochism?

Actually, the question I asked was a simple one concerning the design. Graham could have EASILY visited Titania after talking to the Arch Druid in Episode 2 and asked about her homeland. Even if she gave him some excuse, the plot hole would be closed. A lot of the plot holes I've pointed out in the past like the Shamir one are never answered in game, but answered OUT OF THE GAME with some excuse. That's not a sign indicating a strong, well written story if holes in the story have to rectified outside of the game, after it's out. A story should be able to close any holes internally. Ever watch RedletterMedia's reviews of the Star Wars prequels?

And no, dude, KQ was developed in 1991-1992. VGA technology was pretty much in it's infancy when they were developing KQ6. Even scaling was a brand new idea that hadn't really been done before. I truly doubt technologically it was ever considered given they were working with largely new techology, and KQ was used as the testing ground for such technology. Sierra's games always tried to be as cinematic as possible, always hit on VERY fine, tiny points. The only limit to their creativity was the technology available. They were great. Comparing KQ6's sprites to that of Uncharted, a game which came out SEVENTEEN YEARS after KQ6 is a bit unfair and is a totally, well, stupid comparison.

But as I've noticed, you seem to think you can somehow do KQ better than Roberta could or did (evidenced by you rewriting her games retroactively, in a most disrespectful fashion), and you worship at the alter of Jane Jensen even though she only did one KQ game.

Besides, Cez, after NINE YEARS in development with multiple release dates missed you'd think time would've been invested in fixing these little issues in your game. KQ6 didn't have 9 years. It had one year to come out. I mean this game was supposed to be done in 2005, was "90% complete" last July, etc. So many times it was supposedly finished. Yet year after year delays come up for some strange reason  ::)

Oh no, TSL didn't ruin my life. But it's irrevocably tainted and stained my perception of a series that I've been in love with for most of my life. I tend to be passionate about things I love. And canon or not, it's hurt my concept of the original games, because I sadly can't erase my memories of the revelation that Manannan is Valanice's father, that Alexander is some shell of a person, that KQ is this dark, dreary world, from my mind. It's distorted my perception of the original games and has made playing the originals kind of a depressing experience.

As for why I stick around? Well, it's the same reason people watch a train wreck. They want to look away, but can't.
« Last Edit: March 05, 2011, 07:27:05 PM by Sir Perceval of Daventry »

Offline wilco64256

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Re: Spikey Hair & Held Hands
« Reply #27 on: March 05, 2011, 07:23:21 PM »
Sorry for "irrevocably tainting" this series for you forever, but you do keep coming back and knowingly playing more of it.

And yes we do answer some things outside of the game to provide clarification for things that actually do happen inside the game or that may come up later but we just choose to provide early information on some aspects of the plot.  There will be unanswered questions still for some time, we're only 3 episodes into the thing.
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Offline Cez

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Re: Spikey Hair & Held Hands
« Reply #28 on: March 05, 2011, 07:29:19 PM »
Fine, you win. All you say is correct.

*Goes to do something productive*


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Re: Spikey Hair & Held Hands
« Reply #29 on: March 05, 2011, 07:32:52 PM »
Fine, you win. All you say is correct.

*Goes to do something productive*

Yeah, I kind of knew I was correct I was all along  ::)
Unlike some people I know, though, I can admit when I'm in the wrong  ;)

Does "doing something productive" = strangling giraffes and taking ten years to develop a piece of horrible fan fiction and hyping it up like it's the best thing since sliced bread?

Offline wilco64256

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Re: Spikey Hair & Held Hands
« Reply #30 on: March 05, 2011, 07:36:37 PM »
It was actually only 8 years (it would take anybody that long if they were shut down on multiple occasions) and for bad fanfiction we've gotten a surprising amount of both local and international positive press coverage, covermounts on major gaming magazines, incredible download figures, etc. Weird, I know.
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Re: Spikey Hair & Held Hands
« Reply #31 on: March 05, 2011, 07:41:49 PM »
It was actually only 8 years (it would take anybody that long if they were shut down on multiple occasions) and for bad fanfiction we've gotten a surprising amount of both local and international positive press coverage, covermounts on major gaming magazines, incredible download figures, etc. Weird, I know.

8 years, 9 years, 10 years. Nearly a decade it is still.
And I've heard Cesar himself say the game's development truly began in 2002...which is 9 years ago.
Notice I said, incredibly overhyped? You guys went full PR crazy and hyped up your ''shutdowns'' (which only lasted what, 4-6 months in total between both of them) as some epic battle between the rebels vs the empire.

Not only that, but given that your leader worked for professional companies at one point, and you had Say who was a PR wiz, I can understand the coverage. Hype definitely goes a long way, and I guess in the end, it's not butchering the canon of the series that matters, it's PR, baby.

That's why this was based on KQ to begin with, I'm guessing. An original game with this storyline wouldn't have gotten half the hype or attention this has gotten, and you know that as well as I do. You're in essence riding Roberta's coattails while at the same time rewriting her very own work. A sequel, you know, doesn't have to retcon the originals.
« Last Edit: March 05, 2011, 07:46:22 PM by Sir Perceval of Daventry »

Offline atec123

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Re: Spikey Hair & Held Hands
« Reply #32 on: March 05, 2011, 07:45:04 PM »
Quote
8 years, 9 years, 10 years. Nearly a decade it is still.
And I've heard Cesar himself say the game's development truly began in 2002...which is 9 years ago.
Notice I said, incredibly overhyped? You guys went full PR crazy and hyped up your ''shutdowns'' (which only lasted what, 4-6 months in total between both of them) as some epic battle between the rebels vs the empire.
it was pretty epic.  shuddup.


trolls gon' be trolls.

you remind me a helluvalot like DMD.

ok.  I'm finished.  Nothing useful to add here.
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Re: Spikey Hair & Held Hands
« Reply #33 on: March 05, 2011, 07:46:58 PM »
Quote
8 years, 9 years, 10 years. Nearly a decade it is still.
And I've heard Cesar himself say the game's development truly began in 2002...which is 9 years ago.
Notice I said, incredibly overhyped? You guys went full PR crazy and hyped up your ''shutdowns'' (which only lasted what, 4-6 months in total between both of them) as some epic battle between the rebels vs the empire.

it was pretty epic.  shuddup.


trolls gon' be trolls.

you remind me a helluvalot like DMD.

ok.  I'm finished.  Nothing useful to add here.

I'm DMD, dur.

Offline wilco64256

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Re: Spikey Hair & Held Hands
« Reply #34 on: March 05, 2011, 07:54:25 PM »
Yeah funny how he reminds you so much of that other person who complained about the exact same things.  Interesting.  Fascinating even.

And no, starting a production in 2002 and beginning release in 2010 is only 8 years.  And yes, it was epic - no other fan group has ever overcome two legal battles and gotten this level of release without ever spending a single cent on marketing or pr at all.  We didn't have some super-crackshot legal team helping us out or anything like that, just fans.  Amazing.

Haters will hate but the fact remains that King's Quest is more popular now than it has been in decades primarily thanks to several fan groups that have done some solid work with the series over that time.
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Offline wilco64256

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Re: Spikey Hair & Held Hands
« Reply #35 on: March 05, 2011, 07:55:35 PM »
Quote
8 years, 9 years, 10 years. Nearly a decade it is still.
And I've heard Cesar himself say the game's development truly began in 2002...which is 9 years ago.
Notice I said, incredibly overhyped? You guys went full PR crazy and hyped up your ''shutdowns'' (which only lasted what, 4-6 months in total between both of them) as some epic battle between the rebels vs the empire.

it was pretty epic.  shuddup.


trolls gon' be trolls.

you remind me a helluvalot like DMD.

ok.  I'm finished.  Nothing useful to add here.

I'm DMD, dur.

Yes you are, and just as paranoid and misled as ever.  And most of the people on our team have been playing King's Quest since before you were even born so don't even pull that, "You don't care about this series as much as me" crap...
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Re: Spikey Hair & Held Hands
« Reply #36 on: March 05, 2011, 08:03:25 PM »
Yeah funny how he reminds you so much of that other person who complained about the exact same things.  Interesting.  Fascinating even.

And no, starting a production in 2002 and beginning release in 2010 is only 8 years.  And yes, it was epic - no other fan group has ever overcome two legal battles and gotten this level of release without ever spending a single cent on marketing or pr at all.  We didn't have some super-crackshot legal team helping us out or anything like that, just fans.  Amazing.

Haters will hate but the fact remains that King's Quest is more popular now than it has been in decades primarily thanks to several fan groups that have done some solid work with the series over that time.

You're still in production, though. It's not like all is said and done and the games are out.
No other fan group happened to have their C&D lifted on the team leader's birthday, nor had a leader who worked for the same company that issued said C&D. Gotten this level of release? Eight, nine years in development should produce a pretty good looking game. Yes, shiny things are all that matter. Not the plot or making sure everything is fastened together nicely or staying true to the series you're basing the game in. Nope. Just the epic struggles and pretty graphics.

More popular than it has been in decades? Puhlease. The series was the best selling game series of all time up right to MoE. KQ5 was the highest selling game of all time until Myst came out, or so I've read. Mask itself outsold all the other KQ games or so I've read, and this was 14 years into the series, and only a little over a decade ago. Not "decades", aeons or what have you.

The only reason KQ ''died'' is because the narrow minded new management of Sierra in 1999 didn't see any future for adventure games. They refused to develop any more adventure games and tried making the adventure games in development at the time (SQ7, QFG5, KQ8) more action and RPG oriented. They didn't understand Sierra or KQ. And not long after 1999, Sierra died itself. So, let's not pretend that KQ was some series thrown to the ash heap of history before TSL came along.

King's Quest has always been pretty popular. It never stopped being THE premier adventure game series. The very fact that several fan groups (and a bunch in general over the years) exist and have existed attest to it's popularity and shelf life as a series.

And let's not forget--Sierra considered reviving the series back in 2002 themselves (thank God they didn't), and revived LSL around the same time. The adventure game genre has always been a niche market compared to Action Games and RPGS, but within that niche market, KQ has always reigned.
« Last Edit: March 05, 2011, 08:07:59 PM by Sir Perceval of Daventry »

Offline wilco64256

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Re: Spikey Hair & Held Hands
« Reply #37 on: March 05, 2011, 08:09:39 PM »
Like I said, misled.  You believe whatever you like, we'll keep working on a game that the vast majority of the people who play it like just fine.  Your ranting won't ever convince us to change a thing because it's senseless and incoherent.  The only truly disturbing thing here is how much attention you pay to something that causes you such pain - if I found a game that I detested so thoroughly I just wouldn't play it any more.  What you're doing is just plain unhealthy man.
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Re: Spikey Hair & Held Hands
« Reply #38 on: March 05, 2011, 08:15:46 PM »
Like I said, misled.  You believe whatever you like, we'll keep working on a game that the vast majority of the people who play it like just fine.  Your ranting won't ever convince us to change a thing because it's senseless and incoherent.  The only truly disturbing thing here is how much attention you pay to something that causes you such pain - if I found a game that I detested so thoroughly I just wouldn't play it any more.  What you're doing is just plain unhealthy man.

Hey man, someone's got to speak up. You surely don't think I'm alone in my feelings, do you? ;)
Senseless and incoherent? Are we talking about TSL's plot? If so, I agree with you--senseless and incoherent are good descriptors for it. Good word usage, my man!

Offline Haids1987

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Re: Spikey Hair & Held Hands
« Reply #39 on: March 05, 2011, 08:24:00 PM »
You guys went full PR crazy and hyped up your ''shutdowns'' (which only lasted what, 4-6 months in total between both of them) as some epic battle between the rebels vs the empire.
Can you imagine if it was, though?  :D Duuuuuude, that woulda been a sweet battle!

VIVENDI: Your powers are weak, old man.
CESAR: You can't win, Vivendi. If you strike me down, I shall become more powerful than you can possibly imagine!VIVENDI:  I've been waiting for you, Cesar. We meet again, at last. The circle is now complete. When I left you, I was but the learner; now I am the master.
CESAR: Only a master of evil!
*Epic lightsaber duel.  Cesar slices through the C&D order*
CESAR: I got him!  I GOT HIM!
KATIE (watching from sidelines) : Great, kid! Now don't get cocky!

Bwa ha ha! :rofl:
« Last Edit: March 05, 2011, 08:32:20 PM by Haids1987 »
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