Opinions on King's Quest VII?

[Sir Perceval of Daventry]

Percival could you explain how technology limited the story?  I'm having a hard time connecting the two.

The game was already challenging for two big reasons: One, the rubric for KQ was re-written once again with KQ7: An utterly new interface, an utterly new graphical style. The game for it's time was a pretty big experience. Unless you want the game getting bigger and bigger and eating up memory on 1995 era computers, some things had to be reduced. Unfortunately, this came in the area of the plot. Remember, KQ was meant to be both innovative technologically and also accessible to players--It was Sierra's flagship and also their testing ground for new technology, design and art. King's Quest was never that much a story driven series as it was, being more driven by the environments, characters, and puzzles.

Consider that the reverse happened in KQ6: In order to accommodate a deeper story (and fancy things like a 3D intro and green screen technology), less resources were allocated to the art of the game (Compare for example the level of detail in the backgrounds of KQ5, to those of KQ6.) 

Basically, KQ7 (in the view of some) suffered from the same essential problems as KQ5: Essentially being a testing ground for new technology and interfaces and as such both could be considered (depending on your view) rough around the edges. Had Sierra put out another KQ in the style of KQ7 in say 1996, it's likely it would've been much more refined and generally loved.

[Damar]

I don't see that as an excuse though.  Yes King's Quest was about breaking new ground.  But if that new ground isn't panning out or comes at the expense of putting out a great product, then it's up to the creators to scale it back so that their vision isn't compromised.  The plot of KQ7 was compromised, end of story.  Saying that the game was getting too big and things had to be cut isn't a justification of it.  It's just an explanation.  And if that crappy single icon/hotspot interface was taking up more room than your basic icon interface, then it should have been dumped.  Just because you can break new ground doesn't mean that you should or you're ready to do so.

Also, it was mentioned that Edgar didn't kidnap Rosella in KQ4.  I'd beg to differ on that.  Yes, Lolotte imprisoned Rosella, but it was Edgar who said he wanted to marry this woman he'd just met and therefore made his evil mom kidnap her.  You can argue that he wanted Rosella out of the prison cell but clearly he was doing it for selfish reasons.  There were other skeletons in that cell.  Edgar wasn't talking his mom out of keeping them locked away.  And yes, he did give Rosella a key to escape, but he didn't tell her where his mom was sleeping or give her back her possessions or try to start a coup with the palace guards.  If I can be allowed the conceit to treat these characters like real people for a second, I think it's pretty clear what Edgar's motives were in all of this.  He thought Rosella was hot, so he had his mom force a marriage.  And he let Rosella out of her room so that she could come to his room and get something in before the wedding.  Really, in all seriousness, can you give any other explanation for Edgar's actions besides that?  He didn't help her in any way except giving her the key to every room in the house (and by extension, his room.)  He didn't clear the guards.  He didn't walk her out the front door to help her escape.  He had her kidnapped then invited her back to his room.  Edgar has boundary issues.  His proposal and subsequent kidnapping of Rosella in KQ7 is further proof of that.  And him asking to court at the end of KQ7 might be a slight improvement, but it doesn't undo the kidnapping or the unhealthy fascination he has with Rosella (he must have been watching her to know to entice Rosella to jump in the lake).  Edgar's a stalker and he's got issues.

[crayauchtin]

Here's what I hated about KQ7 -- the simplified interface, that darn dynamite puzzle, and the fact the artists had obviously not seen Valanice in ANY previous games. Ever. At all. They were like "Golly gee, I'm so glad they gave us this fresh, never before seen character to work with!" *facepalm*

But other than that, King's Quest 7 is an amazing story, the puzzles are creative and fun.... and I liked it a lot.

[MangoMercury]

King's Quest VII holds a fond place in my heart purely because it was the game that got me back into the series (after being scared off from it as a young child).  I can see how someone who has played the rest of the series prior to KQVII would possibly see issue with the visuals, the interface, and so on, but I think that, as an introduction into a series, it does its job very well.  It had some great music and characters and, even though I never got far on it when I was younger, I used to love booting it up just to explore the environments.

[Numbers]

Actually, the soundtrack didn't really stick out to me for some reason.  All of the other games--and even the fangames--have easily recognizable tunes that I can identify in a second or two, but not KQ7.  The music is...well, goofy, just like almost all other aspects of the game, and it all seems to run together.  Even MoE, for all its flaws, had a nicely done soundtrack (the downside being that most of the tracks are eerie and unpleasant to listen to; the Swamp Witch's castle is probably the freakiest tune in the whole game).

In fact, the only music I can recall from KQ7 at the moment is the bizarre music that plays whenever the Boogeyman pops out of the ground, for obvious reasons.  I have, understandably, blocked out Rosella's song...

[Sir Perceval of Daventry]

I think Malicia's theme is the best villain's theme in the series.

[Numbers]

I think I know what our next poll is going to be on...favorite villain themes.

[MusicallyInspired]

I didn't like the soundtrack either. I could never get into Neil Grandstaff or Dan Kehler's scores. They just weren't as good as Seibert's, Allen's, or Brayman's.

[writerlove]

As I read through this thread the music from Malicia's house started playing in my head! That was one of the best parts of the game.

I liked KQ7. It had some fun aspects about it. Falderal was funny simply because of how obnoxious it was. The boogey man used to frustrate the heck out of me because he showed up all the time. I liked the poem dittys on the gravestones. Dr. Cadaver was probably my favorite character.

It did have some annoying points though. Valanice was so whiny and weak. I was expecting more from the wife of the greatest adventurer of all time. The little kids in Ooga Booga accomplished their purpose in annoying me.

Now I want to play it again, haha. I don't have it on my computer. Just 4 5 and 6.

[MusicallyInspired]

GoG is your friend.

[wilco64256]

Yeah, off the top of my head I believe GoG sells KQ7 and KQ8 as a bundle for 9.99.  Not bad at all, and they run nicely on modern machines.

[writerlove]

Yeah true. I'm not really interested in playing MOE though. There's probably a let's play around youtube somewhere. And I like GoG. I bought my 4 to 6 pack from them. Haven't had a chance to play them much but it runs great when I do play.

[Sir Perceval of Daventry]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uDzS_Yc0a3M

[MangoMercury]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bODOcBGJSM0

This is totally one of my favourite tracks from the entire game.  I just love that it managed to convey that you were in a dark, depressed place that was under a lot of trouble.

[Blackthorne]

Watching "Let's Play"'s is a losers way out. 

Honestly, the fact that people would go watch one of these things rather than play the game makes me want to vomit up my own intestines and feed them to a rat.   I can't think of anything more lazy and self serving.  You might as well watch a video of someone eating a pizza next time you're hungry.


Bt

[Rosella]

Woah. That's a little inflammatory, Bt.

Keep in mind that not all people play games for the challenge or the gameplay. Some just want to see the story unfold. I know I personally have a lot of games left unfinished because, despite how interested I was in the story and the characters, I just didn't like the gameplay, and found it an obstacle to my enjoyment of the game. If you're mostly interested in the story, I'd liken watching an LP instead of playing a game to watching a movie with MST3K-style commentary instead of just watching the movie. A lot of the LPers out there are witty, engaging people who can bring a lot to the enjoyment of a game.

[writerlove]

Exactly Kelsey Or if you just want your fix of that game and don't have it on your computer. I like to watch Toegoff's of TSL after I've played it. He has a nice speaking voice and he's funny to boot. I don't have the extra money right now to spend on the game. I'm a college student trying to finish my degree and have limited funds. Don't be so quick to judge.

[Blackthorne]

Yeah, but with MST3K, they watch crappy movies you would NOT want to watch without their commentary.  Try watching "Manos, Hands of Fate" without the MST3K guys and you'll claw your eyes out just to make it stop.

Sorry, but it's how I feel.  I think only watching Let's Play's and not playing the game is an insult to the game, it's writers and the whole team of people that worked to make it.  You're only cheating yourself out of the experience.

I'm not saying "never watch Let's Play's", I am saying that if you've never played the game, and only watch a Let's Play of it.... you're just a tool.


Bt

[Klitos]

I recently used a "Let's Play" of KQ3 to check something when I was playing around with IA's KQ3 Gold. It was quicker than playing through to the dragon climax.

[Blackthorne]

I recently used a "Let's Play" of KQ3 to check something when I was playing around with IA's KQ3 Gold. It was quicker than playing through to the dragon climax.

Yeah, but you've PLAYED King's Quest III previously.  (Hell, you programmed KQIII multiple times!)

I'm saying ONLY watching Let's Plays and never playing the game yourself is lame.


Bt