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Tropes vs Women in Video Games

Started by Bludshot, December 06, 2012, 11:48:46 PM

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LadyTerra

Delling, I never intended to imply that bullying isn't bad.  It is.  I'm pretty sure everyone in this forum knows first hand how terrible it is (except for Lamb  ;)).  Just because you became a better person doesn't mean the fact you were bullied wasn't bad.  Bad things happen.  You can't expect to go through life being perfectly happy and secure.  There's always going to be someone out there who wants to be a jerk for some odd reason.  The question is how you deal with it.  Some people can, and some can't.

Besides, you never know how well a defense works without testing it.
I have my cake and eat it too, until it's gone.  Then I can't do either.


Aww!  You have the Sword of Hugging +3!  All of your attacks deal affectionate damage!

snabbott

If hardship can make you stronger, I don't think the source of the hardship really matters. And good coming from bad in no way justifies the bad. I do think the response to the hardship is very much dependent on the person, though. The same hardship that makes one person stronger might break someone else.

Steve Abbott | Beta Tester | The Silver Lining

Blackthorne

Lady Terra sums it up nicely.

I do believe that some people tend to wallow in the pains of their past, instead of moving on.  I maintain my it's not always despite - if you choose to believe that angle, you'll always remain the victim.


Bt
"You've got to keep one eye looking over your shoulder
you know it's going to get harder and harder as you
get older - but in the end you'll pack up, fly down south, hide your head in the sand.  Just another sad old man, all alone and dying of cancer." - Dogs, Pink Floyd.

KatieHal

And, let's indeed try not to start bullying each other over who's method of dealing with bullying is best, shall we? However anyone deals with it and gets through it, whatever works for them, however they want to think about it during or after, it's all equally valid.

Katie Hallahan
~Designer, PR Director~

"Change is the constant, the signal for rebirth, the egg of the phoenix." Christina Baldwin

I have a blog!

Lambonius

We certainly have gotten a fair bit off topic.  I choose to blame Blackthorne.  Now, let's all swing the conversation back to Anita's outfit choices.  Go!

Deloria

There are degrees of bullying and there are degrees of hardship. Not all of them make you stronger. People claiming this absolute "What doesn't kill you makes you stronger" have likely never experienced really, really terrible things. Trauma can just break you. And sometimes, in order to get over trauma like that, you have to make your own catharsis. And *that* might make you stronger, but the trauma that made you get to that point probably didn't. That was your own initiative.
 
Holy Roman Empress
Queen of *all* Albion
Précieuse and salonnière! :D
"In cases of doubt about language, it is ordinarily best to consult women."-Vaugelas
Space! :D Extraterrestrium! :D Espace! :D

Lambonius

Quote from: Deloria on March 16, 2013, 05:07:22 PM
Trauma can just break you. And sometimes, in order to get over trauma like that, you have to make your own catharsis.

My catharsis is riling up strangers on internet message boards.  Better allow it and coddle me though; you don't know what I've been through.

Deloria

Unfortunately, we don't have to be the only ones to enable you. :) There are other message boards on which you can enact all your trollish whims. :)
 
Holy Roman Empress
Queen of *all* Albion
Précieuse and salonnière! :D
"In cases of doubt about language, it is ordinarily best to consult women."-Vaugelas
Space! :D Extraterrestrium! :D Espace! :D

Lambonius

Quote from: Deloria on March 16, 2013, 05:25:40 PM
Unfortunately, we don't have to be the only ones to enable you. :) There are other message boards on which you can enact all your trollish whims. :)

They're all bullies though.  They banned me for acting like a sarcastic ass.

Blackthorne

So, I saw this lady hacked Zelda so you can play as Zelda rescuing Link.

http://kotaku.com/5990946/she-hacked-the-legend-of-zelda-so-it-now-stars-zelda-saving-link

Heh - that's fun.

While I think it's kind of fun and tongue in cheek to do this - or hack Donkey Kong to have Pauline rescue Mario.... I think it'd be straight up fun to have a Zelda game where you played as Zelda.  I mean, a brand new game.... I think a Zelda game, where you play Zelda, in the style of Link To The Past - would be an awesome game.  Gotta admit - it'd be good having to get Zelda bows and arrows, and sword powerups.  Plus, the whole story-line could be different from a traditional Link adventure.

I like all these hacks - but let's get someone to make a full on game now, eh?


Bt
"You've got to keep one eye looking over your shoulder
you know it's going to get harder and harder as you
get older - but in the end you'll pack up, fly down south, hide your head in the sand.  Just another sad old man, all alone and dying of cancer." - Dogs, Pink Floyd.

Lambonius

I saw that too.  Wasn't there a Princess Peach game a while ago?  I'm pretty sure it was essentially all pink and flowery and over-the-top girly, though.

This though--well, any excuse to go replay the original Zelda is fine by me.  :)

EDIT:

http://www.mariowiki.com/Super_Princess_Peach

There--that's the one I was thinking of!  Anybody played it?

LadyTerra

There were already some official non-existent games on a barely known console where Zelda was the protagonist rescuing Link.  They totally don't exist.
I have my cake and eat it too, until it's gone.  Then I can't do either.


Aww!  You have the Sword of Hugging +3!  All of your attacks deal affectionate damage!

Lambonius

#312
I can't see a game with Zelda as the protagonist being done well in today's industry, especially given the crap-sandwiches that are Nintendo products nowadays.

I'd see it falling victim to one of two all-to-common stereotypes:

1) It'd be excessively girly, with lots of unnecessarily "feminine" elements trying to hammer us over the head with the fact that we're playing as the princess for a change.  (See Super Princess Peach as an example of that approach.)

Or 2) It'd be a total GIRL-POWER-a-thon, with an ultra-feminist approach.  Sassy, headstrong, always metaphorically giving the finger to her male counterparts, etc.  The stereo-typical aggressive strong-willed female lead.

Either way--blech.

**Actually, now that I think about it, I could see a third possibility, also terrible.  They could go do a Metroid: Other M thing and make Zelda incredibly weak-willed, whiny, and beholden to her male superiors.

KatieHal

I'd like a game where you play Zelda. She's such an integral part of the games--I mean, hell, we call them the ZELDA games, not the Link ones, and he's the consistent playable character!

A game with Zelda doing the Sheik thing would be awesome. That's the Zelda one I played the most of, so while she apparently was an active and cool character in Wind Waker, too, I didn't play it & can't speak to it.

Katie Hallahan
~Designer, PR Director~

"Change is the constant, the signal for rebirth, the egg of the phoenix." Christina Baldwin

I have a blog!

Neonivek

Yeah the best example of the second is Other M which somehow manages to somehow be less girl power then you would suspect.

Anyhow the reason I cannot see Zelda as the protagonist is mostly because they would probably just turn her into Link. In fact that is what the games (made by third party developers) do to Zelda. They just make her a carbon copy of Link except it is Zelda.

I would kinda like to play a game about Zelda with all the sort of magic and manipulation she does being a large part of the game.

QuoteA game with Zelda doing the Sheik thing would be awesome. That's the Zelda one I played the most of, so while she apparently was an active and cool character in Wind Waker, too, I didn't play it & can't speak to it

Ok I can see that and it would definately be different. Mind you, Zelda is not a pack mule.

LadyTerra

I just pictured a tactics game where you play as Peach directing Toads against Bowser's troops.
I have my cake and eat it too, until it's gone.  Then I can't do either.


Aww!  You have the Sword of Hugging +3!  All of your attacks deal affectionate damage!

KatieHal

Terra, that would be hilarious and awesome. I guess Peach got Merryweather's gift of tactical and strategic knowledge ;)

And playing Zelda as Sheik helping Link behind the scenes would be really cool. The flipside of Ocarina of Time, basically (and maybe without an ending where she's kidnapped the minute she puts her dress back on  ::) )

Katie Hallahan
~Designer, PR Director~

"Change is the constant, the signal for rebirth, the egg of the phoenix." Christina Baldwin

I have a blog!

Lambonius

#317
This video brings up a lot of solid points in support of the "Anita is full of s***" stance.

Now, to be fair, there are a few instances of bad cherry picking, where this guy is actually missing the context of what she's saying, but there are other instances, like her laughable dismissal of sexual dimorphism, that are right on the money.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QJeX6F-Q63I

Neonivek

#318
The problem is that it was ultimately someone who isn't in the culture trying to research the culture rather quickly.

Once again... Listing Elaine and a Damsel.

I am going to have to watch that video eventually and every second I hear something terrible about it just makes me groan.

Mind you so far I don't like the counter video. It makes a good point and then it rants a bit.

OHH DEAR GOSH! Nevermind that video opens my eyes... Anita doesn't know what she is talking about.

And now I HAVE to watch stupid Anita's video because I cannot allow drivel to go by uncritiqued. I'll wait until Damsels are done.

...

Also I want to play Zelda's Strategy game.

stika

Quote from: LadyTerra on March 16, 2013, 06:45:41 PM
There were already some official non-existent games on a barely known console where Zelda was the protagonist rescuing Link.  They totally don't exist.
I actually played the third game in that series for the CD-I it was actually not that bad