Author Topic: TSL Updates!  (Read 198924 times)

Offline Signore Buchelli

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Re: TSL Updates!
« Reply #180 on: June 01, 2016, 09:31:33 AM »
We are so looking forward to playing episode 5, even if it takes another 5 years to be finished :)
:thumbsup: I like patient people. Wellcome!!

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Offline GrahamRocks!

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Re: TSL Updates!
« Reply #181 on: June 01, 2016, 11:03:18 AM »
Just search Phoenix Online Studios on Facebook. Or, you know, just scroll down to the bottom of any page and you'll see the icon. They got Twitter too.

Offline Shalkar

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Re: TSL Updates!
« Reply #182 on: June 03, 2016, 01:58:17 PM »
Hi, everyone. I just wanted to say, I cannot wait for this release. Chapter 5 should be the icing of the cake an I cannot wait to play the game in order. Starting with chapter 1 through 4 then 5. After the final battle with Shardrack I think that's how it's spelled.

I love this game since childhood. I got my first IBM PC when I was about 9 years old. I started with King's Quest IV Pearls of Rosella. Then gradually got and completed the rest of them. Moved on to Quest for Glory, Space Quest, Leisure Suit Larry. Started getting older played almost the entire Adventure Genre in other brand named games.

But King's Quest holds a place dear to me. I am just hoping that it will be done this year an that would be most pleasing to me.

We will see :)

Offline GrahamRocks!

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Re: TSL Updates!
« Reply #183 on: June 03, 2016, 05:49:37 PM »
Nobody turns on subtitles or looks at the credits apparently. It's S-H-A-D-R-A-C-K.

But hey, you sound sincere and you're not complaining for once, so I'm sure the guys appreciate it!

Offline Numbers

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Re: TSL Updates!
« Reply #184 on: June 03, 2016, 10:22:26 PM »
Wow, Signore Buchelli correctly predicted the month Shalkar would come back. That being said, it's not a negative post, so I won't fault Shalkar for it.
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Offline KatieHal

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Re: TSL Updates!
« Reply #185 on: June 04, 2016, 06:25:37 PM »
Thank you and welcome, Absence! That's so awesome you and your dad are playing together. I love hearing things like that!!

And thank you Shalkar, as well!

Also, (ahem):

NAILS!!

 ;D

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Offline Signore Buchelli

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Re: TSL Updates!
« Reply #186 on: June 05, 2016, 01:13:39 AM »
I predicted the same negative post, but I'm glad I was wrong. I hope your post be the beginning of a beautiful friendship, Shalkar.  :) See you at August (2-4-6-8, like clockwork).
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Offline waltzdancing

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Re: TSL Updates!
« Reply #187 on: June 15, 2016, 11:58:29 AM »
One thing that helped keep everyone entertained during the development of the pervious episodes was the four winds newspaper. I would suggest looking that up if you are interested in other side stories.

Offline Numbers

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Re: TSL Updates!
« Reply #188 on: June 15, 2016, 03:08:31 PM »
I should warn people just now getting into the Four Winds that any hint of menace that Lolotte, Lucreto and the Boogeyman had are completely destroyed in those stories, so read at your own risk.
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Offline waltzdancing

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Re: TSL Updates!
« Reply #189 on: June 15, 2016, 09:50:34 PM »
However that are many others that are very good. :) So you have to take the good with the bad.

Offline Numbers

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Re: TSL Updates!
« Reply #190 on: June 16, 2016, 04:47:54 PM »
I'm not going to say that they're terribly written, because they're not--it's just that I don't think they're fantastically written either. Much like TSL itself, the writing's just kind of average. TSL has its well-written and performed moments, like the tower scene(s) in episode three. It also has its corny moments, like the conversation between Graham and Edgar in episode two, and the fourth wall-breaking narrator that caught so much flak back when episode one was first released.

I realize not everyone hates the narration in TSL, but I think that it's just way too long-winded and kind of gets in the way when you're just trying to play the game, not to mention self-indulgent (I'm still not happy about the narrator plugging her own website). And the Easter Eggs involving the narrator, Graham, and sometimes other members of the POStudios staff talking to each other just aren't that funny to me. And other Easter Eggs (like the Suffers or the Bonsai tree) probably aren't funny to newcomers who are just now getting into adventure gaming and have no idea why the ants in episode four keep turning the wooden block into other adventure game characters like Roger Wilco or Leisure Suit Larry, characters they've never heard of. Long story short, there are just way too many inside jokes in TSL, and they're often easier to find than the actual puzzle solutions.

Getting back to The Four Winds articles, I will again say that they're not terribly written, but they're also not exactly superb either. I wasn't amused by the attempt to humanize the Boogeyman, which I felt was a big disservice to one of my few highlights of KQ7. Lolotte got some backstory, but also turned into a nervous wreck who had none of the intimidation factor she had in KQ4. And apparently Lucreto's one weakness is the power of love. That's...good news...? At least Derek got in on the adventuring action, in addition to Andrew, one of the more sympathetic characters created by POStudios.
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Offline GrahamRocks!

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Re: TSL Updates!
« Reply #191 on: June 16, 2016, 05:22:14 PM »
I think I have an easier time with the writing in TSL because it, at the time I first played it, actually gave a damn about characterization at all. They didn't just go, "What Roberta said goes" and just stick to flat characters like AGDI did, but gave them something new. Sure it was different and controversial, but new=/= bad. If anything, seeing all those Easter eggs actually peaked my interest and made me broaden my horizons beyond KQ. Making me care about the characters is both strengths of the new KQ and of TSL.

Granted, there ARE a few moments where I don't like the writing. For example, the scene where Cassima and Graham talk, not in it's entirety, but the lines by Graham asking her to tell him about Alexander do kinda bother me because I figured he'd know most of this already. Not everything, mind you, but her bringing up that he's afraid of losing what he has I think is something Graham should have known already, even if he never talked to Alexander about it. Also, unless he was trying to hide it, you'd think Graham would have known Alexander was interested in the subject of magic. Then again, it IS a time of peace up until now, so he probably only learned it for practicalities sake.

Another example is in episode four, right after the Pandora's Scroll scene. Graham just learned all about what the Black Cloaks did in the past and their methods... and yet it doesn't click in his head until later, long after the player has pieces things together, that they're trying to undo time and reality itself even though they were reversing stuff like healing through their power as mentioned in the scroll he just got. The thing that happened in the past is now happening again in the present and only now does Graham take notice of it and it clicks in his head.

Offline Numbers

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Re: TSL Updates!
« Reply #192 on: June 17, 2016, 03:22:02 PM »
I would argue that, although TSL gives characterization and depth to our heroes, it's not as smartly written as AGDI's games, flat though they may be. Contrast the death messages between TSL and KQ2+, for example. TSL's death messages tend to be needlessly lengthy and not particularly funny or clever--Graham falling through the grate in the floor in episode four, for example--whereas in KQ2+, you get some of, if not the absolute, best death messages in any KQ game, fanmade or otherwise.

Some of them are poetically written so that they rhyme. Some of them are clever. My favorite by far is taking too long to open the Sharkee vault, at which point the narrator informs you that "You had a window of opportunity, but you threw the latter out of the former." Some of them are hilarious. A good one is falling off the small ledge into the ocean, which gets you a message saying that "You have a quiet funeral, attended by all your new carnivorous friends." Some of them are genuinely creepy, like the message you get when you die via toxic swamp. But they're generally smart, short and sweet, and as they say, brevity is the soul of wit.

I was disappointed when playing KQ3 Redux to learn that the death messages had taken a massive step backwards. They were utterly devoid of the humor and goofy charm that made the first two KQ remakes so fun to die in. The KQ2+ message you get when you fall to your death, "You have just discovered the gravity of your situation," is replaced in KQ3 Redux with "Watch your step!" Come on, AGDI. Any idiot could have come up with that.

Getting back to TSL's writing, there are definitely slip-ups in it. When you were referring to Graham's conversation with Cassima, you were absolutely right about how awkward it was when Graham says to her, "What is Alexander like...as a man?" That's a bit of a personal question there, Graham. I'm also not fond of the part where Saladin says to Graham, "I'm just as clueless as you are." That's not very nice of Saladin to say, is it? I mean, they might as well have just had him say "I'm just as big of a dumb-ass as you are" and we would've gotten the same effect.
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Offline GrahamRocks!

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Re: TSL Updates!
« Reply #193 on: June 17, 2016, 07:55:55 PM »
I don't really mind the wordiness of TSL, but that's just me, and I have a bad habit of being very wordy myself as I'm sure you've noticed. And to be fair, that's probably the reason why there's a "Short Narrations" option. That and the ability to turn off the narrator's voice.

Still, no game, no story has perfect writing or humor. There's always going to be flubs somewhere. There are still a few jokes and lines in KQ2015 that I still don't get.

Offline KatieHal

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Re: TSL Updates!
« Reply #194 on: June 24, 2016, 05:58:53 AM »
Overall, I don't disagree :) Most of TSL was written a looong time ago, and yeah, there's a lot we wouldn't do today, or would do differently if it were an official KQ game. Wordiness is definitely one of those things! As are in-jokes. The more you do, the better you get. :)

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Offline GrahamRocks!

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Re: TSL Updates!
« Reply #195 on: June 24, 2016, 10:47:28 AM »
Plus, like Infamous Adventures's King's Quest 3 remake, it WAS your first game. You can only hopefully learn from the mistakes you made.

Though I am curious, besides the wordiness, what you would have done differently or not at all nowadays more specifically?

Offline Numbers

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Re: TSL Updates!
« Reply #196 on: June 24, 2016, 07:23:36 PM »
Plus, like Infamous Adventures's King's Quest 3 remake, it WAS your first game. You can only hopefully learn from the mistakes you made.

That's actually a pretty good analogy. IA's KQ3 remake is rather weak, and even IA themselves seem to view it as an old shame. Their SQ2 remake, on the other hand, knocked it out of the park, and that's the one that they promoted the most.

This doesn't just extend to IA either. For how good AGDI's other remakes were, their remake of KQ1 did very little to stand out. All of the text, music and artwork was lifted almost directly from SCI KQ1 with barely any new tweaks besides adding in voice acting and an Easter Egg here and there. Their next game, KQ2+, was friggin' amazing.

Meanwhile, POStudios went on to do Cognition, which got a considerable amount of positive feedback. All three teams learned from their first game, and all three teams had a very solid sophomore effort.
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Offline Signore Buchelli

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Re: TSL Updates!
« Reply #197 on: June 26, 2016, 12:39:51 AM »
there's a lot we wouldn't do today, or would do differently if it were an official KQ game. Wordiness is definitely one of those things! As are in-jokes.
I love too much the in-jokes and all kind of jokes, references, easter eggs, funny bugs and so.  :D

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Offline Rock Knight

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Re: TSL Updates!
« Reply #198 on: June 26, 2016, 10:19:39 AM »
As someone who was one of TSL's biggest detractors years ago...We were all younger then. The missteps in TSL's writing aren't as glaring as they once seemed. It's easy to overindulge when you're working on something that's not only your first project, but also a massive labor of love. Years ago, I didn't agree with the direction TSL took KQ, especially in terms of the storyline. While I still have some misgivings with that aspect of the game, I can honestly say it is much much truer to the spirit of KQ than the new official game is, it is a greater sequel than that game is,  and that's a pretty astounding achievement considering the bulk of the writing for TSL was done by people who were young, not very experienced, and, I don't mean this disrespectfully, amateurs, working for free. The team at Phoenix created a game that can easily stand with the other entries in the series, and I look forward with anticipation to seeing the game completed.

Offline Numbers

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Re: TSL Updates!
« Reply #199 on: June 26, 2016, 02:16:42 PM »
I love too much the in-jokes and all kind of jokes, references, easter eggs, funny bugs and so.  :D

That's okay, but "funny bugs" aren't really something a game developer should be striving for. I don't think there are that many game creators out there who say to themselves, "Well, there's a huge game-breaking glitch in here...but it's funny, so what the hell, let's just leave it in."
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