Author Topic: I'm a little dissapointed...  (Read 5212 times)

Offline DanielAMV

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I'm a little dissapointed...
« on: December 03, 2007, 12:36:35 PM »
First let me say i'm from the class of KQ 1,2 and 3, and this is coming from that perspective.

I was dissapointed first, that the style of the game went toward  the Kindgom of Daventry being a more of a metropolis, I liked the "empty" kingdom feel of the first ones, which I thought gave it more of an adventure feel, sort of like what Shadow of the Colossus did, makes you feel like that was a real adventure.

That brings me to my next point, there really isn't any style to this game, and maybe I'm the only one who thinks so, but I always thought Kings Quest was really built around it's style. Everything blends together so blandly, nothing sets it apart. Take in the demo, when you go into your room, there on the wall is Graham's hat, that's his hat, it's an icon! but it just blends right in to the room (which by the way needs some perspective to it) you have to make that sucker stand out, give that place some personality, the whole castle is really all over the place in it's design.

Next - Too much dialogue. I'm just judging this on the trailer and the intro, but dang, overdramatic much? Come on this isn't LotR, don't try to make it something it isn't.

King Graham. What the heck happened to him? He's a stinking softy! look this guy has been through hell and back, several times, now all it seems he can do is hang his head and sigh. I've always pictured him as a quick witted mischevious guy who can't stand his kingly duties. Kind of like the Diehard guy in a Fantasy world.

It's great that you are doing this and I know that alot of my complaints are about that fundamentals behind your game and can't be changed because of what the game is.  I just had to speak my peace because I hold Kings Quest in such high regard, but maybe you can just keep this stuff in mind as you go.. So best of luck to the entire team

Offline Bludshot

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Re: I'm a little dissapointed...
« Reply #1 on: December 03, 2007, 08:24:07 PM »
I completely disagree. I like a good story, but then again I enjoyed from KGVI the most.
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Offline PirateKingChris

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Re: I'm a little dissapointed...
« Reply #2 on: December 03, 2007, 09:10:59 PM »
"I've always pictured him as a quick witted mischevious guy who can't stand his kingly duties."

I'm sorry, but what? I don't know how you see that in any of the past games.
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Offline Boogeyman

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Re: I'm a little dissapointed...
« Reply #3 on: December 04, 2007, 12:41:50 AM »
I agree. That descriptions fits Rosella more than anyone else in the royal family.
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Offline jewelkid87

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Re: I'm a little dissapointed...
« Reply #4 on: December 04, 2007, 03:17:51 PM »
^Agree

And to the main poster, I think I understand what you are saying about the first kings quest games being and "open" land and this one isnt. This one follows the trend of kings quest 5, 6, and 7 more IMO. I like it better that way too. Its still the same game but it has just evolved. The enpty kingdom stuff for KQ has been done and I don't think it would go over as well anymore for a new kings quest game. The same happened with Final Fantasy. The older games were a lot different than the newer ones, but its just evolved from what it used to be. And KQ6 is my fave so far from all of the KQ games and TSL(demo) reminds me of KQ6 a lot. I can't wait for the game!

Offline Yonkey

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Re: I'm a little dissapointed...
« Reply #5 on: December 04, 2007, 07:49:58 PM »
Welcome DanielAMV, and thanks for providing feedback. :)

I was dissapointed first, that the style of the game went toward  the Kindgom of Daventry being a more of a metropolis, I liked the "empty" kingdom feel of the first ones, which I thought gave it more of an adventure feel, sort of like what Shadow of the Colossus did, makes you feel like that was a real adventure.
The TSL demo only shows scenes from Isle of the Crown, and one from Isle of the Sacred Mountain.  It follows KQ6 style, since those scenes are all from KQ6.  There are more "empty" scenes in the game, but they haven't been shown publicly yet. 

That brings me to my next point, there really isn't any style to this game, and maybe I'm the only one who thinks so, but I always thought Kings Quest was really built around it's style. Everything blends together so blandly, nothing sets it apart. Take in the demo, when you go into your room, there on the wall is Graham's hat, that's his hat, it's an icon! but it just blends right in to the room (which by the way needs some perspective to it) you have to make that sucker stand out, give that place some personality, the whole castle is really all over the place in it's design.
As for objects blending in, I think that was intentional.  If every inventory object you needed to interact with stood out, this game would be too simple and essentially become nothing more than a glorified pixel-hunt. :P We prefer the player to be able to explore, and the team has added more descriptive dialogue to scenes which accomplish this.

Next - Too much dialogue. I'm just judging this on the trailer and the intro, but dang, overdramatic much? Come on this isn't LotR, don't try to make it something it isn't.
I agree that there is a lot of dialogue and a lot more drama in TSL than any previous KQ game.  Again, I believe this was intentional by design.  We weren't trying to develop a run-of-the-mill KQ game.  We wanted to make something creative where we could give proper closure to the series.  Naturally, this means the game must answer plot holes and questions that were never previously addressed.  Also, since our characters have multifaceted personalities, there is obviously going to be more drama, relative to past KQ games.

King Graham. What the heck happened to him? He's a stinking softy! look this guy has been through hell and back, several times, now all it seems he can do is hang his head and sigh. I've always pictured him as a quick witted mischevious guy who can't stand his kingly duties. Kind of like the Diehard guy in a Fantasy world.
Once you see the introduction cutscene you'll have a better understanding as to why Graham is so melancholy.  Of course, he does not remain in this emotional state for the entire duration of the game either.  He, like other characters, change as events unfold.

It's great that you are doing this and I know that alot of my complaints are about that fundamentals behind your game and can't be changed because of what the game is.  I just had to speak my peace because I hold Kings Quest in such high regard, but maybe you can just keep this stuff in mind as you go.. So best of luck to the entire team
I'm glad you expressed your concerns, and I hope that this helps you understand why we made these particular design decisions.

First let me say i'm from the class of KQ 1,2 and 3, and this is coming from that perspective.
I'm addressing this point last because it really doesn't have much bearing on your other points.  It's fine to use KQ1-3 as your benchmark, but you should also keep in mind the era that those games were developed and technological limitations surrounding those games.  They had limited graphics, dialogue & plot because of technological limitations. 

Each game had to fit in 512KB of RAM & 1.44MB of storage space or less!  There was also a budget.  They only had enough money to develop a game within a certain timeframe, again placing limitations on the game development.  Since we don't have these particular limitations in TSL, we're not restricted by them.  There are of course standards and guidelines that we use, but they're no where near as restrictive as they were in 1984-1986.
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Offline Cez

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Re: I'm a little dissapointed...
« Reply #6 on: February 21, 2008, 12:45:41 PM »
regarding the dialogue and the drama, yes, there's a lot of it, and that's because I wanted to fully develop these characters. When you say this isn't LoTR, that's funny, because that's exactly what I was aiming at. I've said before and many times that this is a mixture of KQ, LoTR and Final Fantasy. That's where I drew my inspiration for the writing.

Regarding the "style", I'm not sure what you mean by style. Making a hat stand out is not style. We enhance the moment by changing Graham into his suit and playing some music to go with it, but again, nothing of that is style. That's more of direction. the style, for example, in art, is the fact that everything tends to look "painted" even though it's 3D. Making thigns stand out is not style, that's "hints" to the player to where to look at. When you blend them together, you are giving them a consistent style.

We chose to set this game in the Green Isles, so you can go complain to Roberta about the metropolis part :P

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Offline dark-daventry

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Re: I'm a little dissapointed...
« Reply #7 on: March 01, 2008, 07:11:52 PM »
I personally like the game as it currently is. Keep in mind that the Demo is just a demo. It's not the finished product, and I'm sure that things have changed. TSL seems much more cinematic than the other KQ's from my perspective, and I prefer it that way. KQ would really make an excellent movie. TSL is the final chapter of the KQ series. I prefer to think of TSL as the official final chapter. To me, TSL is as good or even better than a commercial game could be, and TSL is designed to bring final closure to the series. It answers almost all our questions, and it is truly an amazing game in my eyes. I would likely prefer TSL over a KQ made by Vivendi because TSL is made by dedicated fans, FOR dedicated fans, rather than it being made by developers who seek nothing more than money. The more money they get, the more they'll squeeze KQ. TSL is made by people who aren't being payed a single penny to make the game. It's being made in their spare time, and for that level of dedication, I give TSL an instant 10 on the rating scale just for the attempt and the passion put in this game. Whether it turns out good or bad is meaningless to me. TSL is a continuation of KQ, and the final chapter, and I am satisfied that an attempt was made. If this game fails, I will always have my memories of KQ, and the memories of this forum and all the dedicated members here who poured their heart and souls into this game. Sorry for the long rant, but this game is most likely better than any VU KQ game you'd find. And I understand your criticisms, and it's always good to voice them. This team appreciates feedback.
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Offline awesomeasapossum

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Re: I'm a little dissapointed...
« Reply #8 on: March 05, 2008, 04:48:44 AM »
If this game fails

The only way it'll fail is if you haven't updated your video drivers. :suffer:
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Offline dark-daventry

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Re: I'm a little dissapointed...
« Reply #9 on: March 05, 2008, 12:09:48 PM »
lol good point A3P. I never suggested that it will fail, I was just giving a hypothetical situation. Thank god I just upgraded my family desktop with a graphics card. Before it never had one, but it finally does... Well, I can surmise that it'll be out by as late as November. That's my best estimate for it's release. I speculate that it'll be out no later than November. I'll make a bet if anyone's interested. If it comes out after November 2008 (after November meaning December and onward) I'll eat 10 boxes of Chocolate Pocky. I am not a fan of chocolate pocky... And be aware that I have the full discretion to move my estimate. Only I can't move it to december to cheat. I can only move it to any month before November. And yes, I fully realize that was completely off topic...
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