Author Topic: Is TSL Narrator the new Cedric?  (Read 52443 times)

Offline kindofdoon

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Re: Is TSL Narrator the new Cedric?
« Reply #20 on: July 19, 2010, 03:33:20 PM »
You know what the TSL narrator reminds me of?  A nagging wife, particularly when she scolds or mocks the player for simply trying to explore the game.  I hope no one takes that as a sexist remark, because that's not how it's meant.  But it's true... it's like the game comes with a built-in nagging wife to constantly tell you how stupid you are!!  ack!      :o

I totally agree on this. The narrator should be a neutral storyteller.

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Offline crayauchtin

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Re: Is TSL Narrator the new Cedric?
« Reply #21 on: July 19, 2010, 06:59:27 PM »
I like Amy as a narrator but even those who don't have to agree she's less annoying than Cedric because we don't have to wait for her to leave a screen after we do. GEEZ for someone who can fly Cedric is ungodly slow. :P
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Offline kindofdoon

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Re: Is TSL Narrator the new Cedric?
« Reply #22 on: July 19, 2010, 07:03:09 PM »
Haha, good point there.

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Offline wilco64256

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Re: Is TSL Narrator the new Cedric?
« Reply #23 on: July 19, 2010, 07:43:33 PM »
That is an excellent point.  I'd guess that around 10% of my total playtime in KQ5 is spent just waiting for Cedric.
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Offline Baggins

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Re: Is TSL Narrator the new Cedric?
« Reply #24 on: July 19, 2010, 08:17:50 PM »
A race, to see how long it takes for Amy to finish her longwinded narration, and Cedric to leave the screen.

My guess Cedric beats Amy.
Well, ya, King's Quest is on Earth. Daventry is very old city from a long time ago. It's in ruins now and people aren't quite sure exactly where it used to be. There are some archaeologists searching through the ruins, they think they know its Daventry. But its somewhere on Earth."-Roberta Williams http://kingsquest.wikia.com/wiki/File:Daventryisearth.ogg

Offline Enchantermon

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Re: Is TSL Narrator the new Cedric?
« Reply #25 on: July 19, 2010, 08:37:05 PM »
My problem with Cedric wasn't that he was annoying, but that he was pretty much useless. If you didn't engage him in conversation at all, then 95% of his lines consist of him saying some form of the phrase "I'll wait for you here," which isn't terribly helpful. The right way to do a companion in an adventure game is like Max in Sam and Max: use him as a part of puzzle solutions. Quippy comments (when invoked, not just randomly talking) are fun, but optional. In the new Sam and Max episodes, Max can also give you hints on how to solve a particular problem if you get stuck, which is occasionally helpful.
Another good example of an adventure game companion is Boogle from Torin's Passage (if you've never played it, I highly recommend it). He never spoke words, and the little communication he did provide were emotive grunts and whimpers. And when he wasn't needed, he jumped into Torin's bottomless backpack and disappeared. Best of all, he was necessary for the solutions to several puzzles, which made him more than just an extra animation cluttering up the screen.
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Offline wilco64256

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Re: Is TSL Narrator the new Cedric?
« Reply #26 on: July 19, 2010, 08:39:32 PM »
Boogle was an excellent example of what an adventure game sidekick should be like.  And I really loved that game, I still have it around here somewhere...
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Offline Baggins

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Re: Is TSL Narrator the new Cedric?
« Reply #27 on: July 19, 2010, 09:26:59 PM »
Oh, I suggest trying to beat the game without Cedric it leads to one of the dead end, death scenes.

He does have a few uses.

1. He offers a few random though generally useless clues if you talk to him.
2. He act as a kind of narration where you'll normally only get big red Xs by trying to look at the screen yourself.
3. He initates the Weeping Willow's song, if you talk to him while on the weeping willow's screen.
4. He's part of several important puzzles generally involving saving his sorry butt (captured in the Ice Palace, attacked by Harpies).
5. He saves your life in the end game.
Well, ya, King's Quest is on Earth. Daventry is very old city from a long time ago. It's in ruins now and people aren't quite sure exactly where it used to be. There are some archaeologists searching through the ruins, they think they know its Daventry. But its somewhere on Earth."-Roberta Williams http://kingsquest.wikia.com/wiki/File:Daventryisearth.ogg

Offline KatieHal

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Re: Is TSL Narrator the new Cedric?
« Reply #28 on: July 19, 2010, 09:35:41 PM »
I have to admit I'm not all that convinced he saves your life. I mean, yes, the game makes it look that way, but all he really does is fly in to...warn you Mordack's there? We knew that! Then he gets zapped and the wizard's battle ensues. He doesn't even get zapped jumping in front of a hit meant for Graham!

I really wanted him to do something like save your life or something at the end of that game. But he just...didn't. He was there, and annoying, and never went anywhere dangerous except for when he was captured and had no choice.

I haven't played it this way, so what happens if you just leave him injured with the Harpies and don't get him healed? Do you die as a result at some point?

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Offline wilco64256

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Re: Is TSL Narrator the new Cedric?
« Reply #29 on: July 19, 2010, 09:38:45 PM »
I'm working on a replay of KQ5 at the moment and haven't gotten that far yet, but I think you do die later if you don't save him.  Been years since I played this one though so I can't say that for certain quite yet.
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Offline Baggins

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Re: Is TSL Narrator the new Cedric?
« Reply #30 on: July 19, 2010, 09:43:26 PM »
Katie, he took the blunt of hte last vestiges of magic from the wand, and weakened the wand even further. You already weakened it in the mysterious contraption. If you don't save Cedric, that blast is enough to kill Graham, and leads to one of the game's death sequences, and one of those "oops" I forgot something moments.

The game is pretty clear on that detail.

So ya the game punishes anyone who tries to kill Cedric.
« Last Edit: July 19, 2010, 09:47:28 PM by Baggins »
Well, ya, King's Quest is on Earth. Daventry is very old city from a long time ago. It's in ruins now and people aren't quite sure exactly where it used to be. There are some archaeologists searching through the ruins, they think they know its Daventry. But its somewhere on Earth."-Roberta Williams http://kingsquest.wikia.com/wiki/File:Daventryisearth.ogg

Offline KatieHal

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Re: Is TSL Narrator the new Cedric?
« Reply #31 on: July 19, 2010, 09:48:50 PM »
I don't know that I'd say the game is clear about it--unless you actually do get killed by that, I'm guessing?--since I had no idea the cheese-run contraption weakening it wasn't enough.

It still didn't quite make for enough payoff for Cedric being around and not being helpful the whole time, really. But I now find his comments more amusing since watching a Let's Play of KQ5. "A POIsonous snake!" heehee

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Offline Baggins

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Re: Is TSL Narrator the new Cedric?
« Reply #32 on: July 19, 2010, 09:57:52 PM »
Yes, this is the third time I'll explain it. If you don't save Cedric, the wand kills you even though you weakened it. The blast is enough incinerate you. It then tells you forgot to save Cedric, to warn you he was needed to take the majority of that blast.

I'm sure there is a youtube video that will show you the death :p...

There is also a narrator line or two that mentions that Cedric took a powerful blast instead of you, and saved your life :p...

Its also hinted in KQ5 that he might be dead, with Crispin reviving him. In the KQ5 NES and Companion its said he's turned to stone, with Crispin reversing the spell.

Here is the nese death montage, see the final death for the no save cedric path;
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5KWSKYICmDg

Here is a quick montage from the PC version.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fgF_Y437cVE

Quote
Cedric because we don't have to wait for her to leave a screen after we do. GEEZ for someone who can fly Cedric is ungodly slow.

I went and checked again, but you don't have to wait for Cedric to fly off the screen. Actually there is a half second delay while he leaves his perch, before it loads the next screen, and a half second delay for him to land in the next screen. So its much less than waiting "10%" of the game for him to fly. Its more like waiting .0001% of the game for him to take off, and land (you don't have to worry about the actual flying)... I barely notice it.

Actually what's more intriguing is he may take off after you leave the screen, but he lands before you enter the next screen. So that actually means he quite a fast flyer.
« Last Edit: July 20, 2010, 07:03:27 AM by Baggins »
Well, ya, King's Quest is on Earth. Daventry is very old city from a long time ago. It's in ruins now and people aren't quite sure exactly where it used to be. There are some archaeologists searching through the ruins, they think they know its Daventry. But its somewhere on Earth."-Roberta Williams http://kingsquest.wikia.com/wiki/File:Daventryisearth.ogg

Offline KatieHal

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Re: Is TSL Narrator the new Cedric?
« Reply #33 on: July 20, 2010, 07:37:15 AM »
Baggins if I counted every time I explained the same thing over and over again one here, I would be completely out of fingers and toes by now :P

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Offline Baggins

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Re: Is TSL Narrator the new Cedric?
« Reply #34 on: July 20, 2010, 07:56:34 AM »
You could have said, if you had a "nickel" for every time you explained things, but Activision would probably issue a cease and desist. :suffer: :suffer: :suffer:
Well, ya, King's Quest is on Earth. Daventry is very old city from a long time ago. It's in ruins now and people aren't quite sure exactly where it used to be. There are some archaeologists searching through the ruins, they think they know its Daventry. But its somewhere on Earth."-Roberta Williams http://kingsquest.wikia.com/wiki/File:Daventryisearth.ogg

Offline Delling

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Re: Is TSL Narrator the new Cedric?
« Reply #35 on: July 20, 2010, 08:34:55 AM »
lol... wow, Baggins, that's just bad XD but then I'm still laughing... XD
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Offline sahara

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Re: Is TSL Narrator the new Cedric?
« Reply #36 on: July 20, 2010, 09:53:51 AM »
I really wanted him to do something like save your life or something at the end of that game. But he just...didn't. He was there, and annoying, and never went anywhere dangerous except for when he was captured and had no choice.

Yeah, that's really funny.  :-)  Everything you said is so true.  You're right that not having him in on the action at the end, at least, was a missed opportunity.  In Star Wars they had R2D2 in some action scenes where he used clever tricks to beat some fighter droids, winning the little character more respect from the audience.

The more I think about it... I feel a little bad for Cedric.  Nearly everyone dislikes him.  :(  Now I kind of hope he makes an appearance in TSL.  What are the chances?  Maybe TSL will give him a scene to redeem himself?  

I also wonder if Cedric was inspired by that metal owl in the original Clash of the Titans movie:  http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Hoy8MEL9N3M  

I also always thought Zazu (sp?), the hornbill bird from The Lion King, reminded me of Cedric.  Anyone else ever think that?
« Last Edit: July 20, 2010, 09:59:17 AM by sahara »

Offline Baggins

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Re: Is TSL Narrator the new Cedric?
« Reply #37 on: July 20, 2010, 10:33:41 AM »
Hmm, I think KQC stated his inspiration was based on a little Archemedes, a little bit of the Athenian Owls, a bit of Dr. Watson, as well as the clockwork owl. But then again that might have just been Peter Spear's speculation.
Well, ya, King's Quest is on Earth. Daventry is very old city from a long time ago. It's in ruins now and people aren't quite sure exactly where it used to be. There are some archaeologists searching through the ruins, they think they know its Daventry. But its somewhere on Earth."-Roberta Williams http://kingsquest.wikia.com/wiki/File:Daventryisearth.ogg

Offline Enchantermon

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Re: Is TSL Narrator the new Cedric?
« Reply #38 on: July 20, 2010, 12:36:39 PM »
I also always thought Zazu (sp?), the hornbill bird from The Lion King, reminded me of Cedric.  Anyone else ever think that?
Zazu has Rowan Atkinson behind him though, so he wins regardless. ;)
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Offline shadyparadox

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Re: Is TSL Narrator the new Cedric?
« Reply #39 on: July 20, 2010, 01:20:16 PM »
Put me down as someone that appreciates the "Narrator Voice Off" option. (Though she comes back during the death sequence?)

She's not horrible, but she talks too slow and the messages are too long for me to wait on her. I also don't believe in narration that breaks the fourth wall, whether it's explicitly acknowledging this is a computer game, or talking with the characters, or anything else.

I prefer the more subtle references like the ones in the pawn shop in KQ6.