Episode 2 - CONSTRUCTIVE feedback (No fighting, please!)

[waltzdancing]

I definitely don't have a problem with the missing areas from KQ6.  In fact, I'd like to see fewer and fewer areas from KQ6 in subsequent episodes!     More original material, please!  Thanks! 

I can only tell you that it will get better. Your adventure has only deepen with the closing of Episode 2, now the real fun begins.

[KQ5Fan]

My only requests would be

1. Harder puzzles - It makes the game seem longer
2. More screens - Although I realize this isn't possible, but I'm just hoping that there'll be more screens to visit in Ep. 3.

[KQIX-Team]

Okay, that was funny. I've read all five pages of this so called constructive feedback thread now. What's the conclusion? Many people want more puzzles and more location, right? Alright. You say you're not going to expand the first two episodes and you are not going to make additional locations or puzzles for episode 3-5. Correct? So the next three episodes won't get any more complex than now. In other words: Nothing important is gonna change. My question: What kind of constructive feedback do you really expect from us? 

[KatieHal]

Actually, that's not at all what we've said. We've quite clearly pointed out that there will be more locations in later episodes.

[Astor]

If possible, could some of the non-essential dialogue paths for a few of the characters be kept open, say asking Hassan what he thinks of the IoW? I mean once you're done talking they basically just stand there like drones with only the "Goodbye" option available.

[Jujuba]

C'mon, People! The silver lining is here! We should be happy! 

It's just a fangame! Do be so serious! 

[wilco64256]

Okay, that was funny. I've read all five pages of this so called constructive feedback thread now. What's the conclusion? Many people want more puzzles and more location, right? Alright. You say you're not going to expand the first two episodes and you are not going to make additional locations or puzzles for episode 3-5. Correct? So the next three episodes won't get any more complex than now. In other words: Nothing important is gonna change. My question: What kind of constructive feedback do you really expect from us? 

Either you misunderstood what we said or you're just being deliberately difficult.  Either way, to clarify - we're not changing the length of the first two episodes at all, they're out the door and done.  Each future episode will continue to expand the game, providing more scenes and original locations to visit.  As the game continues to expand and more locations open up, it also gives us more room to develop puzzle work and gameplay so expect to see that expand as well.

[ChillyChile]

It's a very difficult and hilarious game!  I don't think we're even 1% done, and we spent 1 hour on it! 

[darthkiwi]

Okay, that was funny. I've read all five pages of this so called constructive feedback thread now. What's the conclusion? Many people want more puzzles and more location, right? Alright. You say you're not going to expand the first two episodes and you are not going to make additional locations or puzzles for episode 3-5. Correct? So the next three episodes won't get any more complex than now. In other words: Nothing important is gonna change. My question: What kind of constructive feedback do you really expect from us? 

Obviously I can't make you like the game. If you played it and didn't like it then that's just your own lookout. But bear some things in mind:

- POS said they would have more puzzles and locations in Ep2 than Ep1. They did this.
- Each episode is only a fraction of the entire game. Bear in mind that the five episodes should be thought of as a whole. The whole game, I suspect, will have enough puzzles and locations to rival most commercial adventure games.
- These people are doing this in their free time, for free, and have already made the engine technically very sophisticated and graphically powerful. The artwork is very good for a fan game. This is a good fan product.
- Constructive criticism has been incorporated into Ep2. They acceded that there were not many puzzles, but also added a "Shorter narrations" option, improved Graham's walk animation, allowed him to run, improved pathfinding and made it possible to switch the narrator's voice off. These were all issues which were raised after the release of Ep1 and they were all rectified. Evidently, POS does respond to constructive criticism.
- The idea that they would go back and alter existing episodes is unreasonable. They've finished them after a very long time and two C&Ds. To say, "No, this isn't good enough, add another year to development time" is not fair on these people. Plus, they want to finally start work on their own projects (like C9) and want to get KQ done quickly. Not shoddily, but I don't blame them for wanting to move on after all this time and all this grief.
- This game was not specifically designed for the puzzles. Yes, that was an aspect of it because it's a KQ game, but the main reason this game exists is to give closure to the story of the royal family of Daventry. That has always been its aim. As such, you shouldn't be at all surprised that the game's story is more prominent than in other KQs and that the puzzles are perhaps not always as prominent.

[wilco64256]

Nice post darthkiwi, that's an excellent summary.  We are also working to improve Episode 3 even further based on feedback and hope to continue to follow this pattern all the way through the end.  The storyline we're working on won't change, and past episodes won't be altered, but we're more than happy to make reasonable tweaks to actual gameplay elements to help make the game be more enjoyable for people.

And you are right that the game isn't designed specifically to be puzzle-based.  Future episodes will contain more puzzles than previous ones, but it is still an "adventure" game, not a "puzzle" game (off-topic very briefly - for the latter, try Professor Layton and you can puzzle til your head explodes).

[Big C from Cauney island]

Darthkiwi had a good summary. The purpose of this project is to bring closure to the series, and I think it is doing a great job. I did a review some were else on the forums, the only critique I had was with some puzzle aspects. But I stress SOME. The puzzles were still good, I did get stumped at points. Isle of wonder puzzle was great.  Other than that, it's cool the developers fixed so many things based on feedback. It made a huge difference. So thats my feedback.  But again, its so hard to judge a game when I haven't played the whole thing. The best a fan can do is give feedback per episode. Keep up the good work POS. Anxiously awaiting episode 3!

[Lambonius]

I want to reiterate an earlier post of mine concerning one of the things that I found pretty immersion breaking--black screen load times when transitioning from scene to scene.  The computer I was running it on is pretty high end, yet these load times often lasted several seconds--which, in a modern game (especially a strongly plot driven one where the player is anxious to see what happens next) seemed like an eternity at times.  I'm not sure what could be done in terms of optimizations to solve this, but definitely something you guys should look into, if you aren't already.

[wilco64256]

I want to reiterate an earlier post of mine concerning one of the things that I found pretty immersion breaking--black screen load times when transitioning from scene to scene.  The computer I was running it on is pretty high end, yet these load times often lasted several seconds--which, in a modern game (especially a strongly plot driven one where the player is anxious to see what happens next) seemed like an eternity at times.  I'm not sure what could be done in terms of optimizations to solve this, but definitely something you guys should look into, if you aren't already.

I FULLY agree and we are looking into cleaning this up.  In some ways it's just a limitation on the engine that we use, but we're trying to see what we can do to speed things up.

[Lambonius]

I FULLY agree and we are looking into cleaning this up.  In some ways it's just a limitation on the engine that we use, but we're trying to see what we can do to speed things up.

Good to hear.  

The abusive narrator comments would be the other main fixable problem.  It wasn't as much of an issue in Episode 1 because there weren't really any puzzles, but with Episode 2, more puzzles means that players are going to be doing a LOT of clicking on stuff--and so far pretty much every single response is insulting to the player.  Someone on the AGDI boards commented that the narrator should laugh WITH the player rather than AT them, and I think that's a good rule of thumb to take to heart here.  An adventure game should reward experimentation, not discourage it.

[daventry]

I agree, lets Not Bully the Player or Graham with Insults.

By the way as i said before, please do something with the Sound or Voices when i speak to Characters, sometimes they go Soft to Normal. 

Oh and Please tone Down the Clams, they are So Loud that i cant Hear what the Narrator say or Hassan. 

[wilco64256]

I agree, lets Not Bully the Player or Graham with Insults.

By the way as i said before, please do something with the Sound or Voices when i speak to Characters, sometimes they go Soft to Normal. 

Oh and Please tone Down the Clams, they are So Loud that i cant Hear what the Narrator say or Hassan. 

Note that if you have adjusted any of the audio sliders, the game is under the impression that you're setting things up just the way you want them and won't make any automatic adjustments of background sound or music on its own.

And those are oysters

[MangoMercury]

Speaking of narration issues, I was wondering what the likelihood would be of specific lines going with specific "objects", for want of a better word.  Just sometimes the interactions don't really work well with what has been clicked on.  Two examples come to mind - first one was when I clicked to talk (I believe) to the lady in the restaurant; I was told "Graham cannot interact with that -object-".  The second one, I think I clicked the hand on the floor or something, and it came up with the "Guards!  Guards!" line.  Neither of which make much sense.  

So really, I'm wondering as I said, whether specific items will get singular interactions in the future, or whether they'll continue to be general ones?

[wilco64256]

Speaking of narration issues, I was wondering what the likelihood would be of specific lines going with specific "objects", for want of a better word.  Just sometimes the interactions don't really work well with what has been clicked on.  Two examples come to mind - first one was when I clicked to talk (I believe) to the lady in the restaurant; I was told "Graham cannot interact with that -object-".  The second one, I think I clicked the hand on the floor or something, and it came up with the "Guards!  Guards!" line.  Neither of which make much sense.  

So really, I'm wondering as I said, whether specific items will get singular interactions in the future, or whether they'll continue to be general ones?

Sometimes - it just depends on whether we have set the game up to recognize that specific object as unique and separate from the background behind it.  It does take extra work so it's not possible to do unique interactions for every single object but we are working on improving this a bit as well.

[MangoMercury]

That's definitely understandable; I guess it's more for the lady than the floor that perhaps a line could have been made, but great to know that you guys are striving for improvement!

[Enchantermon]

Note that if you have adjusted any of the audio sliders, the game is under the impression that you're setting things up just the way you want them and won't make any automatic adjustments of background sound or music on its own.

I didn't adjust any of the audio sliders and I found this happening as well.