Are we going to get stuck again?

[kirl]

The original Kings Quest series was littered with wrong options were you could waste mission critical items, and get stuck forever, wondering wherever you went wrong. I recently played some of the old series again and was reminded of how terribly difficult these old games really were (and equally rewarding when I got the surprisingly blatant plug of space quest when I peeked in a hole somewhere).

Anyway, my question is: Are we going to get stuck like we once did by wasting critical items?


Congrats on the green light, I can't wait to play this!

[koko_99_2001]

If I remember correctly, you will be unable to proceed without essential items. It may be that you can't leave a building or an island without something.

This may have changed, but it was the plan when I started beta testing.

[kirl]

But are you able to lose or squander these essential items, so that the only way to proceed is by loading an earlier save where you still had these?

[KatieHal]

Kiri--our goal was to eliminate that from being the case. There are no 'you didn't get this in Episode 1, so now you're screwed in Episode 5!' items or circumstances.

[Enchantermon]

If I remember correctly, you will be unable to proceed without essential items. It may be that you can't leave a building or an island without something.

Unable to proceed...how far? I don't care for the idea of being locked to a certain location (inside the castle, for example) until you find everything you need, as long as you can go back to that place later and search some more. Doing so makes the game feel more claustrophobic. I don't necessarily care for dead ends either, but that's why you have multiple save slots.
Although if you can't go back to a certain location, then it would be a bit more understandable.

[KatieHal]

Basically, having certain items or conversations will trigger other events to happen. If you're finding that things seem to be 'stuck' at some point in the game, you're missing something that's needed to move things along. We've tried to give subtle hints in the game if/when it comes to that, things that can point you to what it is you need to look for, etc.

[B'rrr]

So there is no way to reach a dead end? if you are stuck you can awlays go back to get the item you need?

Like you need a pie to proceed and happen to have eaten it; nomnomnom! and now there is no way to get a second pie. things like that?

[Enchantermon]

Basically, having certain items or conversations will trigger other events to happen. If you're finding that things seem to be 'stuck' at some point in the game, you're missing something that's needed to move things along. We've tried to give subtle hints in the game if/when it comes to that, things that can point you to what it is you need to look for, etc.

Cool. I can live with that.

[kirl]

Kiri--our goal was to eliminate that from being the case. There are no 'you didn't get this in Episode 1, so now you're screwed in Episode 5!' items or circumstances.

Thank god... I mean, thank you guys!

All was going smoothly in KQ1, until after a hiatus of a couple of days I finally broke down and resorted to using a guide, only to find out I had to replay pretty much the entire game to preserve some essential item I squandered. Doh!

In one of the later games I happily munched on a pie in much the same way B'rrr just described with the only effect being that I just wasted my only silver coin. But I saved that time, fool me once and all that.

[Baggins]

It sounds like they are looking towards more KQ7 format, you couldn't actually get stuck in that game. You couldn't miss any items (with exception of the Extra Life). You didn't need the extra life to finish the game, you would just happen to get the bad ending. However in most cases if you somehow missed an essential item, the item would be located in an alternate spot. For example the smelly flower's location changes depending on which chapter you enter, or if you missed it early on.

I remember KQ6, had at least one dead end, like it was possible to enter into the palace short path without everything you needed (the wind-up nightengale, or did the maids only show up if you had the nightengale?). There were some where the game would warn you, if you didn't have all the items (the game won't automatically put you into the catacombs unless you have everything), or it would just flat out kill you before you got in too far (the druids will kill you if you don't have the lamp spell prepared). But that was essentially something you could easily reload, without wasted time.

KQ5 was probably the worst, there weren't alternative puzzle solutions, and very easy to progress far into the game, before you know you missed something crucial. Like a couple of hours into the game in some cases.

The early ones weren't as bad as five, there were plenty of alternate puzzle solutions, and the so-called dead ends were more or less along the lines, of entering a cave or location without a proper item, and almost instantly being killed. So you would have wasted five minutes at the most. I'm referring to the troll cave in KQ4 for example, which it was very easy to enter, without a board to cross the chasm, or even get into the swamp, without having the flute for the cobra. But it wasn't a dead end per se, as you could always back out and get
those items, or just reload.


KQ5 on the other had, had areas that once you passed, you couldn't get back to the previous areas.


KQ3 had a couple of the one way linear areas, and no way back as well. But you knew from the manual everything you had to get, as far as the spells were concerned. Also I think there certain things you had to do before the pirates would even show up.

KQ2, pretty much made you get everything you needed as progressed, or provided alternate solutions, the only true dead end was if you crossed the bridge too many times. Granted I suppose you could have been stupid and made things into dead ends, like flying up the mountain on the carpet, and then leaving before you finished everything (doesn't hte carpet disapear on the return trip?). You could get to Dracula's castle without the need of the sugar cube but it was hard. In case you missed an item, certain characters would randomly disappear from their locations, so you could enter without them being there and get the essential items you needed (dracula, hagatha, etc). ...or you were allowed to back track until you found something you needed.

KQ1? I suppose you could get to the Land of the Leprechauns without everything you needed, and without items for alternate solutions, but I think you really needed to go out of your way to do that. Can anyone think of any other dead ends?

[Enchantermon]

In KQ6, if you don't get the River Styx water before crossing the river in Charon's boat, you're stuck. There's no place after that for you to get it and without it you can't make the paint for the doorway. Plus, if you get to that point, you've already used Beauty's clothes to extinguish the fire in the cage, so the short path is out.

KQ1? I suppose you could get to the Land of the Leprechauns without everything you needed, and without items for alternate solutions, but I think you really needed to go out of your way to do that.

It's possible. I don't know about the condor showing up if you don't at least have the fiddle or four-leaf clover for use against the leprechauns, but it's definitely possible to jump down the hole without the mushroom. It's also possible to get stuck down there even with everything you need. The mushroom lasts only a short time; when I got down there my very first time, for some reason I could not get Graham all the way through the hole; he kept getting stuck on something. Eventually, my time ran out and he walked back into the cavern on his own so he could return to his normal size, and then I was stuck.

You could get to Dracula's castle without the need of the sugar cube but it was hard.

You can? How? Dodge the thorns, if that's even possible?

[I_am_so_nifty]

Dodging the thorns is possible, unfortunately. It's what my family did for years--until we learned about the Pegasus.

How were we supposed to know to throw a bridle on a snake?

[Enchantermon]

Dodging the thorns is possible, unfortunately. It's what my family did for years--until we learned about the Pegasus.

Wow. Kudos for that. I tried once or twice and then decided that it was impossible.

How were we supposed to know to throw a bridle on a snake?

Agreed. That was one of the stranger, doesn't-quite-make-sense puzzles in the game.
I guess the fact that all of the items in the lamp can be used to get the second key is supposed to be a clue, but it's still pretty vague.

[Delling]

Dodging the thorns is possible, unfortunately. It's what my family did for years--until we learned about the Pegasus.

Ditto. ...it is such a pain.

[Baggins]

It's possible. I don't know about the condor showing up if you don't at least have the fiddle or four-leaf clover for use against the leprechauns, but it's definitely possible to jump down the hole without the mushroom. It's also possible to get stuck down there even with everything you need. The mushroom lasts only a short time; when I got down there my very first time, for some reason I could not get Graham all the way through the hole; he kept getting stuck on something. Eventually, my time ran out and he walked back into the cavern on his own so he could return to his normal size, and then I was stuck.

Heh, at least its right in plain sight, rather obvious, and right next to the hole. Unless you screwed up your saves, you are 1 minute from a reload :p.

How were we supposed to know to throw a bridle on a snake?

Its been awhile but isn't there an obscure clue on the bridle itself, if you look at it? Like a picture of a snake?

[I_am_so_nifty]

I know that there was a snake on the dagger, which lead us to the conclusion to kill the snake. I'm not sure about the bridle.

Come to think of it, we also always killed the giant instead of waiting until he sleeps. We weren't always very good at the whole "not killing" thing. But, being the youngest, I can luckily blame it on my older siblings for figuring out those ways.

[crayauchtin]

In KQ6, if you don't get the River Styx water before crossing the river in Charon's boat, you're stuck. There's no place after that for you to get it and without it you can't make the paint for the doorway. Plus, if you get to that point, you've already used Beauty's clothes to extinguish the fire in the cage, so the short path is out.

You could also enter the catacombs without the brick and leave them without the shield -- both of which would leave you utterly stuck (although both of those would kill you, I suppose....)

[I_am_so_nifty]

I checked the bridle. There is no snake on it.

[Enchantermon]

Heh, at least its right in plain sight, rather obvious, and right next to the hole. Unless you screwed up your saves, you are 1 minute from a reload :p.

Perhaps in the AGI version (which I've never played), but in the SCI version it's on a separate screen. But yes, still one minute from a reload.

You could also enter the catacombs without the brick and leave them without the shield -- both of which would leave you utterly stuck (although both of those would kill you, I suppose....)

Brick, yes, but you can always come back for the shield.

[Baggins]

know that there was a snake on the dagger, which lead us to the conclusion to kill the snake. I'm not sure about the bridle

Ya, must have been the dagger I was thinking about. Hmm is the bridle on a snake an obscure fairy tale?

Perhaps in the AGI version (which I've never played), but in the SCI version it's on a separate screen. But yes, still one minute from a reload.

Yes, I know they are seperate screens, but its in a particularly prominent place, that you probably have seen pretty early on, but just can't reach it. By the time I get the island, I already know where that screen is.

You could also enter the catacombs without the brick and leave them without the shield -- both of which would leave you utterly stuck (although both of those would kill you, I suppose....)

I thought, they give you a chance to go and find those? If you return without them, they send you directly with without a second warning. If you have everything needed, then alex will automatically say he's ready.